Bankers Warn Against House Price Speculation….No, Really, They Do

Reddit

–Well ANZ’s Phil Chronican is not going to win any friends at the country club if he keeps saying things like this. Chronican says there isn’t a house price bubble in Australia because there wasn’t the huge over-building of new supply here like there was in America. The lack of inventory overhang, he reckons, will prevent prices from crashing. But he’s not exactly bullish on house prices either.

–“There is no doubt,” he writes, “the capital gains made by most people in the property market over the past 15 to 20 years has created an unsustainable perception of housing as an attractive investment vehicle…Remember, the primary purpose of a house is as a place to live, not a speculative investment vehicle.”

–Ye gads. That is downright sensible.

–Chronican also had the audacity to suggest some of the Australians who were lured into the housing market over the last two years with the first-home buyer’s grant are in danger of getting behind on their mortgage. He said mortgage arrears are, “a problem that is going to stay with us for a while. I don’t know if it will get worse or not…It is a concerning trend … yes, you want to watch it, but it is not a disaster.”

–Hopefully it won’t be. But if it is, it’s largely self-inflicted, or government inflicted. Australia did not have a huge “sub-prime” class of loans that led to house price gains but put marginal buyers at risk. So the Rudd government went ahead and created that class with the first-home buyer’s grant. And now those folks are in trouble.

–By the way, our own in-house house-price uber bear, Kris Sayce, is on his way up to Sydney this week to clash swords with the property bulls. The  massive steel cage match event features eight speakers, each of whom will make their case, followed by questions from the crowd. It begins at noon tomorrow at the Wesley Centre on Pitt Street. Tickets are $50. Go here for details on how to register.

–It looks like the share market will open up this week doing more of what it did last week: going down. Wall Street had another bad Friday. The Dow Jones Industrials have closed lower for five straight weeks. That’s the longest losing streak on the Dow since 2004—the early days of Alan Greenspan’s great reflation.

–You’d expect the Australian market to have “de-coupled” from the performance of the Dow and the S&P 500. After all, the earnings of Australia’s biggest companies are determined by Chinese demand for things like iron ore and coal, or the ability of Aussie banks to grow their loan books in commercial and residential property. Yet take a look at the chart below and you’ll see that since markets became even more casino-like in early March of 2009, the Aussie market has tracked the U.S. market step by step.

Dow and All Ords Bounce 50% from GFC Lows

aordvdow.png

–The chart shows the weekly closes of both the Dow and the All Ords. The weekly close smooths out a bit of the day-to-day volatility in the price action and gives you a picture of the trend. By the way, this chart doesn’t take into account currency movements. That’s important.

–Foreign investors, especially Aussies, would have much smaller returns in U.S. stocks once they converted their money back into local currency. The decline of the U.S. dollar may make U.S. equities cheaper and more attractive. But it can also ruin your return. Conversely—and this is one of the arguments behind a recent recommendation we made in AWG—a weaker Aussie dollar means you might get a nice bounce in your U.S.-listed investments.

–What else is interesting on the chart? Well, both the All Ordinaries (the green line) and the Dow (the black line) have gone up by about 50% since March 9th of 2009. That’s a big bounce. What’s notable is that the All Ords—mostly because of rebounding commodity prices—recovered a lot more quickly. You can see that by April of 2010, the Aussie index was easily outperforming the Dow.

–The Dow has only recently hit the 50% up mark from the March lows of 2009. And as you can see, the All Ords have consistently bounced at the 50% level. Murray Dawes at Slipstream Trader has identified this level—about 4,700 on the All Ords—as the “point of control” for the price action. If you’re not sure what all that means, you should check out Murray’s explanation of what’s going on in this video presentation.

–Murray ducked his head into the office this morning, incidentally, to point out how strange Friday’s action was. The euro rallied. But both the U.S. dollar and U.S. stocks fell. This is an unusual departure from what’s been going on the last 18 months are so. The dollar has habitually rallied a bit when fears about “growth” dent emerging markets and commodities. Is that changing now? Hmmm. Stay tuned.

Dan Denning
Daily Reckoning Australia

Dan Denning
Dan Denning examines the geopolitical and economic events that can affect your investments domestically. He raises the questions you need to answer, in order to survive financially in these turbulent times.
Reddit

Comments

  1. The DJIA put in a bottom at around 6600 in March 2009. So it’s up about 100% since then according to my maths. The All Ords bottomed at around 3300. So it’s now up around 50%.

    Reply
  2. Somebody graphed QE3 hits on google for me

    http://www.zerohedge.com/article/google-trends-qe3

    I have something of my own invention to contribute though. I’m calling it downward index extorsion …. (die)

    the barbeque cometh …

    Reply
  3. Your chart shows the XJO and DOW at roughly similar levels since March 2009, but the DOW is up 82% and the XJO only 45% in the same period of time (as of today).

    Stuart C
    June 7, 2011
    Reply
  4. Yes. I was just working to the nearest 50% – Which seems reasonable enough given market volatility over the last decade doesn’t it??? :D

    Though the basic point is still valid I guess – Namely that the All Ords hasn’t decoupled from the DOW?

    Reply
  5. Must have missed something here… . Chronican is a bankers(?) :D

    It’s DRA’s policy to amp any bad news, but multiple Chronicans???!~ ;)

    Reply
  6. @ Ned.S

    I suppose it depends how you look at the figures. The chart is supposed to exclude currency movements and still show a bounce in the XJO of 45%, yet the XJO effectively flatlined in May of 2010 – the same time as the AUD started to rise toward the $1.10 mark. The AUD has matched the DOW since then, offsetting the performance of the XJO. I don’t see how you can exlude currency movements from the argument.

    I think the chart is misleading however, as it shows the percentage increase over time of the XJO on the LHS and the increase in points of the DOW on the RHS. As they are disparate measurements, the chart will scale them to fit together. Any conclusions drawn from this chart are essentially flawed.

    Stuart C
    June 8, 2011
    Reply
  7. Agree about it being inappropriate to exclude exchange rate movements Stuart. But Dan does make the point that the graph doesn’t include them. And stresses the fact they are important.

    Also see he’s acknowledged the maths error in today’s DRA article.

    Reply
  8. Awaiting a correction, too. Deletion of ‘They’ in the headline, perhaps? ;)

    Reply
  9. You ONLY get so many corrections for free on a free-for-all service Biker! :D

    Reply
  10. lol! While the current and previous governments can all be found guilty of driving a housing bubble, its a bit rich for the banks to call foul. Afterall, they are the ones who are now lending out 95% and 97% mortgages! They even lend out 100%+ mortgages to first home buyers saying that the grant will bring the leverage back down to 95-97%… Yet, they encourage them to redraw he money out for ‘personal holidays and house goods’.

    You may have heard the so called biggest recovery in home loan approvals in the past 25 years today (after the biggest fall in the past 25 years just a month ago)… yet what you don’t hear, is that this has nothing to do with increasing incomes or decreasing unemployment. The fact is, at the exact same time, the big four banks DOUBLED the amount of 95-97% mortgages!

    Given that first home buyers are exempt from stamp duty, this means, any joe blow with $0 in their bank account, a mountain of credit card debt, and is one pay check away from starving can get a home with not a dollar down! Don’t forget these jokers are using 80% of their after-tax incomes to service the loan. And with the RBA on the war path to higher rates, at least 1% over the next year or two… I foresee a CRASH, not this crap about stagnation and letting incomes ‘catch up’… the fact is, property is about to crash hard, down 50% at the least. Remember that even if you have 0-3% capital growth per year, rental yields are only 3% and interest rates are 7-8%, hence a person who is negatively geared, is every year, making a net loss of 5-10%… even with tax considerations. Your going to see a tidal wave of home owner defaults and property investors panic sell investment property… consider that no property investor has had a net profit on anything purchased in the past 5-10 years…

    Check out these stats: http://www.smh.com.au/business/banks-offer-bigger-loans-to-homebuyers-20110603-1fjvn.html

    “The number of mortgages with a maximum loan-to-value ratio of 97 per cent doubled to 5 per cent in June from 2.5 per cent in January, RateCity said.”

    “Currently, loans with LVRs less than 80 per cent make up 2 per cent of all mortgages, while 36 per cent are between 80 and 95 per cent LVR, RateCity said.” – Shocking, 36% between 80-95%….

    Who said we don’t have a debt or subprime problem?

    Reply
  11. Ming: “…its a bit rich for the banks to call foul…”

    BankS?

    BankerS?

    tHEy?

    HE.

    Reread the headline. Reread the article. ROFLMFAO… :D

    Reply
  12. …i don’t see the link between “price” and “supply” when buyers avail themselves with heaps of money so generously lent to them from the bottomless barrels at mortgage bankers’ disposal…heck, add helium to a balloon and it rises, makes no difference if some kid wants it or not…

    Reply
  13. Ming: “Shocking, 36% between 80-95%….”

    Easily shocked if you believe a homebuyer who has 19% equity in his home is sub-prime, Ming.

    Now if RateCity had given a 20% figure of 5 – 10% equity, how much more convincing would their data be?

    But, as Chris Joye recently noted (9/06/11):
    “The RBA estimates that only 2.5% of all borrowers have a loan-to-property-value ratio equal to or greater than 90% and are paying away more than 50% of their disposable income to service their repayments.”

    Other recent research indicates that while Aussie homeowners have more debt than eight other western nations’ homebuyers, they’re far more comfortable with their housing debt than those in the other eight.
    That’s great news, but a large percentage of Aussie homebuyers are also making more than the required payments.

    Don’t be blue. Holding your breath waiting for a housing crash just isn’t worth it. You’d have expired _years_ ago. ;)

    Reply
  14. Ming

    You are arguing with “Biker Pete” he thinks he is earning 7% tax free on funds he puts into a mortgage offset account.

    This simpleton is not able to understand the basics.

    He has my vote for Village Idiot & after you converse with him for a while you too will be casting your vote for him.

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    June 13, 2011
    Reply
  15. Pinhead (That’s you Biker Pete) where is you link to prove:

    But, as Chris Joye recently noted (9/06/11):
    “The RBA estimates that only 2.5% of all borrowers have a loan-to-property-value ratio equal to or greater than 90% and are paying away more than 50% of their disposable income to service their repayments.”

    The US Fed gave a ringing endorsement to their banks late 2008 & publicly stated that they were comfortable with US Debt levels.

    You are just a Idiot in search of a village.

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    June 13, 2011
    Reply
  16. “There’s no buyers. There’s no demand. The economy is just not strong enough, and in which case we could go back to test some horrible lows.”

    Are they talking about the property market? NOPE, the share market: http://www.perthnow.com.au/business/business-old/market-to-track-sideways-for-six-months/story-e6frg2qu-1226074127886

    Reply
  17. Pinhead he quotes the RBA but gives no link to the RBA where they say it.

    He is selectively quoting them out of context.

    When you read the RBA comment in whole it is totally different.

    Don’t worry I don’t expect you to understand after all you think you are earning interest at 7% + Tax free in a mortgage offset account, when in fact all you do is save paying interest.

    Do you get that yet?

    Simpleton!!

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    June 13, 2011
    Reply
  18. Don’t worry, I don’t expect the angry tenant of a housing commission home has any experience whatsoever in property. ;)

    You’ve repeatedly proven, by your _own_ admission, you’re a chronic liar.

    Not surprised to find you over here. They all know you _much_ too well over at PerthNow. Want a link or two for that? :D

    Reply
  19. HaHa.. Minus One? Don’t go sooky on me, son!
    Steve, this fidiot is hitting me with Thumbs Down, mate. Fix it, will ya?

    I nominated you for the Queen’s Honour List, N Fool…
    for services to landlords. Reduced construction, less homebuyers, less investors in the market… we owe you a debt of gratitude.

    Rents are rising. You’re a leg end, N Foot. ;)

    Reply
  20. Rents up $30 pw in the past 18 months & Holding costs up $180 pw ?

    Do the Math!

    You are a clueless Mum N Dad investor with no idea.

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    June 14, 2011
    Reply
  21. Yes, we’re mum’n’dad investors, living (and travelling) very comfortably and fully independently in retirement, thanks to great information and excellent advice about property.

    You’re a Homeswest tenant, who has felt it necessary to continually lie about his circumstances during the last eighteen months.

    You are, in every respect, a poor troll.

    Reply
  22. N Fool: “Rents up $30 pw in the past 18 months & Holding costs up $180pw ?”

    According to RPdata, during the last five years, the cost of renting a house in Perth rose on average 8.7 per cent each year. That’s a 43%+ rent hike.

    During that same period we financed an additional seven properties, mostly at around 8.7- 9.45%. Interest rates then fell out of the sky. The very worst interest rate we ever copped was 7.24%. Holding costs fell by tens of thousands of dollars.

    Your calculation that holding costs would be $180 pw EXTRA* in 2011 was based on your mistaken, oft-expressed view, that rates would rise this year. Like every other guess you’ve made, you were wrong. There are more of these silly punts for 2011 and 2012… and as their projected time expires, I’ll remind you. ;)

    * Your word, my capitals.

    Reply
  23. Biker: “”The RBA estimates that only 2.5% of all borrowers have a loan-to-property-value ratio equal to or greater than 90% and are paying away more than 50% of their disposable income to service their repayments.”

    You say 90% are paying 50% more repayments? { WRONG PINHEAD }

    http://watoday.domain.com.au/real-estate-news/at-31-firsthome-buyers-are-getting-older-20110609-1fut0.html

    This article says half your alleged claim,?

    “As well, 45 per cent overpaid on their repayments, well above the average of 26 per cent in the other surveyed markets.”

    Thats 45% & not 90% of people making extra payments.

    The housing market is not about one individual idiotic investor!!

    I pointed out that FHB & Investors buying in early 2009 @ less than 5% rates now face higher costs of $180 per week plus. Investors from this period have only been able to raise rents by $30 pw to offset these additional costs.

    You know what I said but try to introduce your circumstances.

    Whilst your fantasy investment structure might be healthy or survive, it is the late comers to the Australian Ponzi property market who will drive the price of ALL of your property down & you will have no control over it.

    This is happening today & you are in denial.

    But you are still unable to refute my statement that since 2009 holding costs for investors & FHB have gone up by $180 pw arguing the point with reference to your own circumstances highlights your stupidity.

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    June 14, 2011
    Reply
  24. N Fool: “You say 90% are paying 50% more repayments?”

    Where? I directly quoted Chris Joye. I didn’t cite the 45% overpayment data. It is, however, quite significant. Nearly half Australian homebuyers are _overpaying_ on their mortgages.

    N Fool: “…your own circumstances highlights your stupidity…”

    Amusing, from a self-confessed liar, a Homeswest tenant who is bitter about his impoverished circumstances… and whose guesses about crashes and interest rates have been _consistently_ wrong. ;)

    Reply
  25. Up there with retired wealthy investor who travels the world for six months of the year & has a hobby farm. But still spends 24/7 Blogging Property?

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    June 14, 2011
    Reply
  26. N Fool: Homeswest tenant, chronic liar, dismal prophet of doom’n’gloom, who spends his _life_ pretending to be someone else (continually admitting to previously having lied); whose predictions unerringly fail. Probably unemployed economic refugee, with minimal prospects of ever being employed. Frustrated, sad, bitter fearmonger. Goals: Spread fear, host funny little blogsite radiating envy and covetousness… ;)

    Biker: Retired very comfortable property investor with other diverse assets, who travels abroad for extended periods annually. Enjoys lifestyle property which provides food, water and energy needs… . Blogs around 10% of the time the Enfooled One does. Happy with life, lifestyle, health and assets. Goals: Spread optimism, help others achieve their goals, while poking a little fun at bleaters who’d like to see Oz struggle economically, as they and their own bleak countries have. :D

    Reply
  27. Biker: Fantasy investors who thought he was earning interest TAX FREE on funds he deposited in a mortgage offset account. Established himself as a fool with no idea & Zero Cred.

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    June 14, 2011
    Reply
  28. Biker Pete:

    Merrill Lynch is forecasting that house prices will fall 10 per cent from their peak in June last year, while another broker, JP Morgan, reckons there’s a particular bad debt problem building for loans made in 2009

    Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/business/house-prices-to-fall-but-not-bank-profits-20110614-1g10n.html#ixzz1PFYsLooi

    Not just me Pinhead!!

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    June 14, 2011
    Reply
  29. FAMILIES struggling to pay their bills are staring down the barrel at a $3000 increase in the cost of living in the next 12 months, a new financial year burden that could push them to the brink.

    From July 1 households will be hit with one of the largest rises in electricity, water and gas prices in decades, on top of usual yearly hikes in council rates, childcare, rent and car registration.

    Then add the Federal Government flood levy, which will cost the average family between $300 and $750, and the Federal Budget cuts to middle-class welfare that substantially reduce benefits for 213,642 families under Family Benefit Tax Part A — upwards of $800 a year.

    Read more: http://www.news.com.au/money/money-matters/cost-of-living-to-rise-by-3000-in-next-year/story-e6frfmd9-1226074113134#ixzz1PFeNAhRK

    Not you Biker Pete but real people with real jobs & real costs of living pressures

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    June 14, 2011
    Reply
  30. Real people? As opposed to _chronic liars,_ you mean?

    N Fool: A proven liar, by his own admission. Claimed to be at an auction he later admitted he didn’t even attend; claimed he owns SIX properties: Karratha (4), Woodlands (1), Mandurah (1). Now admits he’s in a Homeswest unit. Here’s a fella who predicted a 20% property crash for 2010; then sent us all a vidclip of Steve Keen stating the Oz market ROSE 20% in 2010. Didn’t even have the nous to realise his SNAFU! He predicted homebuyers would be up for an EXTRA $9K+ in 2011, as a result of interest rate rises. N Fool is a buffoon, a liar, an illiterate conman. He’s a source of continual amusement… . ;)

    You continue to preach fear, economic collapse, and family household trauma for Australians. As the year rolls on, we’ll look at more of your failed predictions. Keep ’em coming, N Fool. :D

    Reply
  31. Biker Pete why skip over your claim of earning 7% plus Tax Free in your Mortgage Offset Account?

    It goes to the Heart of your claim that you are a sophisticated investor, but revels you are a simpleton!!

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    June 15, 2011
    Reply
  32. They were accountS, N Fool. I revel in your ignorance. ;)

    My claim that I’m a ‘sophisticated investor’? Let’s see that link. :D

    Reply
  33. Biker said:
    “Yes, we’re mum’n’dad investors, living (and travelling) very comfortably and fully independently in retirement, thanks to great information and excellent advice about property.”

    Well I’m glad the Baby Boomers are living well off their generational theft. We’ll just carry on being your slaves then shall we? While you live the high life on our crushing tax burden?

    Here’s what I predict for GenX in the future:
    1) Rising cost of living
    2) Rising tax burden to pay for the Baby Boomer ponzi scheme known as superannuation.
    3) Declining wages.
    4) Rising interest rates.
    5) Crushing debt that can never be repaid.

    But by all means, enjoy your retirement Biker. We don’t mind both parents working 80 hours a week, never seeing our children, and going further and further into debt to pay for it. Live it up!

    Reply
  34. X: “But by all means, enjoy your retirement Biker.”

    Thanks, X.

    Happy to pass on what we’ve learned.

    You might add:

    4.5) Rising rents. ;)

    Reply
  35. >> Happy to pass on what we’ve learned.

    You mean I should be stealing from GenY?

    Reply
  36. X: “You mean I should be stealing from GenY?”

    Well, I actually agree with much of what you say, X. Your generation is definitely doomed. Your future is bleak and hopeless. You are completely powerless.

    Look on the bright side. Let’s skip your generation. Generation Y (often termed The Boomers’ Kids) have a very bright future.

    http://www.perthnow.com.au/business/generation-y-most-likely-to-make-sacrifices-to-buy-their-own-home/comments-e6frg2ru-1226071532730

    Our own two GenYs are a pretty good example… . They put themselves through uni, independently; live overseas, independently; and they have significant assets: property, cash, shares, bonds and Super. One even owned PMs until he cashed ‘em. Neither works more than 45 hours per week…. and, interestingly, neither owns a car.

    Here’s how they managed to be well off in their mid-to-late-20s:

    1.) They blamed others (parents, the BBs, the banks, the government);

    2.) They refused to listen to others (parents, teachers, professors,
    mentors);

    3.) They practised instant gratification. “Why wait? We want it NOW!”;

    4.) They looked for the easy solutions, the shortcuts;

    5.) At every opportunity they complained, bitched and bleated….

    I know it looks pretty bleak for you, now, X… but if you follow those five tips and practise them diligently, your future will be brighter, your days happier, your retirement independent of pensions and welfare.

    Good luck on your learning journey.

    Reply
  37. Bleak? Ha! What makes you think I will be sticking around here so I can pay 70% of my income in taxes to support you and your spoiled brats?

    Sure, if I wanted to enjoy the experience of fascism, a police state and a banana republic, I would stay in Oz, but I will be leaving and taking my children with me before you lot move right on to cannibalism to satisfy your rapacious greed.

    I guess your kids will be renting from you right?

    Reply
  38. X: “I guess your kids will be renting from you right?”

    They’re _both_ landlords! :D

    So you’re leaving our fruit-ridden, nazi, cannibalistic shores, X?
    Where do you think you and your children are better off?
    (Probably back where _you_ came from?)

    When I last heard, my rapacious pillaging BB generation had spread right
    across the entire planet, ‘rapping’ and pillaging each new utopia and nirvana we encountered.

    Looks like you’re employing 3.), 4.) and 5.) above, anyway.
    When you and your children arrive at Newtopia, I’m sure jobs and homes
    will be showered on them, just as you’ve taught them.

    Sounds wonderful! :D

    Reply
  39. >> So you’re leaving our fruit-ridden, nazi, cannibalistic shores, X?
    I mentioned fruit?

    >> Where do you think you and your children are better off?
    Pretty much anywhere in APAC, except NZ or Singapore.

    >> (Probably back where _you_ came from?)
    My mother’s stomach is not a country, but I guess you were trying to imply that I am an immigrant. This is because you can’t imagine why any Australian would not want to be a slave to support your ignorant, lazy, incompetent arse?

    >> When I last heard, my rapacious pillaging BB generation had spread right
    across the entire planet, ‘rapping’ and pillaging each new utopia and nirvana we encountered.

    Nope.

    >> When you and your children arrive at Newtopia, I’m sure jobs and homes
    will be showered on them, just as you’ve taught them.

    Oh I see what your idiotic ad hominem attacks are trying to imply. I thought you had switched to ad hominem attack because you lacked the intellectual capacity to form a coherent thought, but now I see that you were in fact trying to make a point, however clumsily. Let me address your accusations one by one then.

    1.) They blamed others (parents, the BBs, the banks, the government);

    Yes, I agree that we shouldn’t bother catching murderers, because the victim should have defended themselves, so it’s the victims fault. Same as bank robbers. The bank was just asking for it putting all that money in the one place. In fact, lets not blame anyone for the crimes they commit, because in every case it is obvious that it was the victim’s fault.
    When I was finishing High School, we entered the ‘recession we had to have’. Apparently, according to you, that was my generation’s fault, as we hadn’t done enough by the age of 17 to prevent it. I see now. And all of those unproductive workers that were continuously going on strike, crippling the economy were really GenXers from the future that went back in a time machine to the 70s. Okay, I understand now.

    2.) They refused to listen to others (parents, teachers, professors,
    mentors)

    Oh, so we GenXers refused to listen to you did we? If we had just listened to you then we would have been fine as our wages declined relative to inflation while yours doubled and tripled. Thanks for the tip. So tell me, what’s your advice? Should I save that ten bucks a week left from my salary for the next 173 years for the deposit on a house? Or should I get 2 more jobs, one at night, and one on the weekend? Please enlighten me.

    3.) They practised instant gratification. “Why wait? We want it NOW!”;

    You are right. I was hungry, so I spent my money on food NOW!. My children were also hungry, so I spent money on that food too. You’re right though, I should have starved my children so I could save for a deposit on a house. Then I would be living the good life like you. My kids, not so much, but who cares about kids right? Your generation sure doesn’t!

    4.) They looked for the easy solutions, the shortcuts;

    You mean like building speculative asset bubbles instead of creating innovative products? That kind of easy solution? Or how about using your voting power to enrich yourself from the public purse? That kind of easy solution? No wait, I know, you mean the getting paid inflation adjusted wages shortcut. Or the outsourcing GenX jobs to India easy solution. Looks like easy solutions and shortcuts work great!

    5.) At every opportunity they complained, bitched and bleated….

    Yeah, because every time I open a newspaper or turn on the TV, there is another GenXer complaining, bitching and bleating. Oh wait no, it isn’t. It’s just another BB beat up on our generation, while praising the coming saviors of our society, your kids.

    Why don’t you just have the balls to come right out and say that you hate us? Would that interfere with your slavery plans? Are you teaching your children how to continue shafting us even now?
    We don’t mind. We’d rather you be upfront about it. Sure there is some Stockholm/Battered Wife syndrome that will keep enough in line, but the rest of us would rather know where we stand.

    Reply
  40. Biker Pete

    No doubt about it you are a world class DIP$HIT!!

    X Nice Bitch Slap keep it up.

    But remember you are dealing with the “Shallow End of The Gene Pool”

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    June 16, 2011
    Reply
  41. NF, I’ve never forgotten I’m dealing with the “Shallow End of The Gene Pool” but I’m generally too polite to infer your intellect issues are genetic. You’re probably right.

    X, N Fool, I can see you’re both _happy_ with the choices you’ve made.
    If you’re not, it’s never too late to change them.

    N Fool, if a Homeswest unit is your preferred accommodation, stay with it.
    Now you’ve admitted your true situation online, you can play the ‘victim’ card, like X. You’ll enjoy more empathy and sympathy. Misery loves company!

    X, if you believe you and your children (note I didn’t say ‘spoiled brats’)
    are better off overseas, start packing for your new improved life. Note also that I ceased reading your angry rant at the point when you used the term “idiotic ad hominem attacks”. I don’t imagine it improved after that… .

    X, may I suggest that Ireland offers everything you could ever want in life? (And the grass is certainly greener.) ;)

    Reply
  42. >> X, if you believe you and your children (note I didn’t say ‘spoiled brats’) are better off overseas, start packing for your new improved life.

    Already done. I’ll be taking my superannuation with me too.

    >> Note also that I ceased reading your angry rant at the point when you used the term “idiotic ad hominem attacks”. I don’t imagine it improved after that… .

    Well, since you attacked my character in your second post, and you attempted a racial slur in your third post, along with using the word ‘nazi’ (who were not fascists btw), I estimated your IQ to be either 95 or 105, depending on whether by ‘fruit-ridden’ you were trying for a play on words, or you really don’t know what the term ‘banana republic’ actually means.

    Given your intellectual inability to carry your side of the argument, much less comprehend mine, I didn’t really expect you to actually read my post, just simply carry on looking like a fool so I could present my replies by way of rebuttal.

    I was going to offer to post under your name on your behalf, if only to raise the plausibility of your position. I understand your generation’s delusional belief system even better than you yourselves do, like the fisherman understands the water better than the fish who are swimming (indoctrinated) in it.

    But thanks for sharing you and your children’s asset classes that you have ‘invested’ in. It makes a good list for what to short sell in the future.

    Ireland. Ha ha. Good one. Aren’t you clever? Read that in the newspaper did you?

    Reply
  43. Much better, X. You see, bitterness and anger aren’t necessary.
    Hope you’ve enjoyed your extended stay with us.
    Advised the missus you’re taking the kids, yet?

    During our lives we develop strategies for getting what we want… and need. If you’re a firm believer in luck, you may not have bothered to develop these skills to full extent. I suppose that if you were taught early in life that the cards are stacked against you, or that someone else limits your potential, why bother?

    If, however, the strategies you are employing aren’t working, you might need to reassess them, rather than continue the blame game… or running away… or hoping that when some fantasy armageddon hits, you’ll rise from the ashes, a _winner_ at last.

    If you’ve read this far, without using that little remote humans have evolved to flick an unproductive commercial, remember that unresolved anger isn’t healthy or productive. When you hear that little *click* it may not be a screenshot. Someone may simply be turning you off. ;)

    Reply
  44. >> Much better, X. You see, bitterness and anger aren’t necessary.
    You mean I should just enjoy my enslavement?

    >> Hope you’ve enjoyed your extended stay with us.
    By ‘us’ do you mean the owners of Australia, or Australians? Are you implying that I was only here by ‘your’ grace? You are trying to imply that I am not an Australian right? I guess you must be a Koori.

    >> Advised the missus you’re taking the kids, yet?
    I know where you are going with that.

    >>During our lives we develop strategies for getting what we want… and need. If you’re a firm believer in luck, you may not have bothered to develop these skills to full extent. I suppose that if you were taught early in life that the cards are stacked against you, or that someone else limits your potential, why bother?

    Wow, thanks for the Tony Robbins seminar. Do you have a home study course of mindless psychobabble for 9 easy payments of 79.99 too?

    >> If, however, the strategies you are employing aren’t working, you might need to reassess them, rather than continue the blame game…

    OK, how about this for a *hypothetical* strategy: I kill you, and take all of your money. I know your wife and your kids won’t blame me, because you have taught them not to play the blame game. That’s just unproductive. Is that a better strategy than what I’ve been doing so far?

    >> or running away…
    Strategic withdrawal, but I guess you wouldn’t understand that, having never had to fight for anything in your life.

    >> or hoping that when some fantasy armageddon hits, you’ll rise from the ashes, a _winner_ at last.

    Actually, I have the law of geometric progression on my side, so in the long term, I win anyway, but in the short term, I concede, you have used your political power to transfer all of my income, through taxes and inflation, into your bank account.

    I didn’t vote for the people who carried out this theft on your behalf, and so my political influence effectively ended when your generation voted them into power. Of course, it doesn’t mean that it will be that way forever. Your generation will eventually pass from this earth, and will no longer be the controllers of political power and capital. But by the time that happens, I will have reached retirement age, so I am not planning on sticking around to support your larceny for the next 30 years. Predators gotta hunt, so I am working on the principle that if I remove myself and mine from your reaches, eventually you will either turn on your own children or preferably, each other.

    I will take my intellectual capital to where it can be put to constructive and creative use. i.e. not here.

    >> If you’ve read this far, without using that little remote humans have evolved to flick an unproductive commercial, remember that unresolved anger isn’t healthy or productive.

    My anger is resolved. I know why I am angry, and who I am angry with. Also, anger is very productive. It might be unhealthy, but it is certainly productive.

    >> When you hear that little *click* it may not be a screenshot. Someone may simply be turning you off.

    I wondered how long it would take you to use threats. You did pretty good, only 5 posts. Do you plan to censor the internet? Or just restrict access to only those people who agree with you?

    Reply
  45. X: “I wondered how long it would take you to use threats.”
    X: “I kill you, and take all of your money.”

    OK, let’s analyse that. I advise that people who get sick of your whingeing will turn off… and you ‘hypothetically’ kill me. :D

    Biker: “If, however, the strategies you are employing aren’t working, you might need to reassess them…”

    X: “What makes you think I will be sticking around here so I can pay 70% of my income in taxes …”

    Now that’s a good example. It’s difficult to imagine why a person with your extraordinarily-high IQ would pay 70% in taxation, when Australia initiated salary packaging / salary sacrifice over two decades ago. People like us, with average intelligence, quickly appreciated the days of PAYE victims paying up to 48% in tax were over.

    Please consider staying in Australia. Your threat to bankrupt Oz by taking your ponzi-super*… and depriving us forever of your higher intelligence… is unbearable. We _need_ people who can outthink fish.

    * The image I saw? TV sitcom scene with little kid with tiny suitcase standing by the door, angrily proclaiming “And I’m taking my piggybank, too.” Encore!~ ;)

    Reply
  46. Biker Pete you truly are a Oxygen Thief.

    But hey you get more & more irrelevant by the day. Keep it up you Muppet!

    Have a look at this post about housing activity in Perth down to 30 year lows & Realtors fleeing the market like Rats on a sinking ship:

    http://nfbpsh.blogspot.com/2011/06/perth-property-activity-at-30-year-lows.html

    BTW my humble blog is averaging over 1200 hits a day this month. the message is getting out there while you howl at the moon.

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    June 16, 2011
    Reply
  47. Read your blogshot, N Fool?

    A blogshot written by a self-confessed liar, a pubic housing tenant who claimed ownership of six investment homes for nearly a year?

    NF: “But remember you are dealing with the “Shallow End of The Gene Pool”
    (We screamed with laughter! Let me guess… You do _stand-up comedy_ on your blogspot, right???!!!~ :D :D :D )

    Reply
  48. But Trav’s I know & you know you had to have a peek!! (Tee Hee Hee)

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    June 16, 2011
    Reply
  49. HaHaHa…! Yes, about a month ago, with friends present, I had a look.
    Happened during a dinner party… and we ALL had a good laugh. :D

    Look, here’s a free, life-changing tip:

    First get your 12 yo…

    Now, display the sentence “You truly are a Oxygen Thief.”

    Ask “What’s wrong with this sentence?”

    Yeah, I know, I’ve attempted to help you with this a dozen times,
    without success, but I’m not giving up on you, DH Lawrence… . :D

    Reply
  50. OK… You did that? Good. Next step…

    Think hard now. What happens when two vowel sounds approach each other?

    No, VOWEL sounds!

    There’s a rule, you see… .

    OK, now post the insult _correctly_ and let me get back to mentoring the
    other DH. ;)

    Reply
  51. No luck? Shucks… . Could well be that gene pool issue you referred to earlier… .

    OK, go next door to the nearest Homeswest flat with a primary-aged kid.

    Show ’em the sentence “You truly are a Oxygen Thief.”

    Now, fend off parental blows, because you forgot to explain your mission.
    (Sorry about that, entirely unintentional! ;) Giggling like a girl might
    help here. Your neighbour will probably stop hitting you, in sheer astonishment… !)

    Now offer a free subscription to your blogspot. Mention you’ll assist
    the family to buy multiple properties… y’know… Karratha, Woodvale,
    Mannnnndurahhhh…. . Now, show the sentence again:

    “You truly are a Oxygen Thief.”

    Here’s the t-r-u-l-y inspirational part. Wait-for-it…..

    If the kid knows the answer, offer procreation to the mother.
    This will _undoubtedly_ deepen your end of the gene pool.*

    * Or, alternately, it may get you thrown off the balcony,
    thus improving the whole planet’s gene pool!~ :D

    Reply
  52. Ah, I see your propaganda skills are honed from a lifetime of lying, but at least for now I still have the right of reply.

    >> X: “I wondered how long it would take you to use threats.”
    >> X: “I kill you, and take all of your money.”

    >> OK, let’s analyse that. I advise that people who get sick of your whingeing will turn off… and you ‘hypothetically’ kill me.

    Actually, I asked if that would be a good strategy in an environment in which nobody is blamed for anything. So you failed reading comprehension, ok, no blame. But the question still stands. You claim that the secret of success is to never blame anyone for anything. Someone assaults you, no blame. Someone robs you, no blame. Someone defames you, no blame. Drunk driver runs a stop sign and T-Bones you, no blame.

    I already KNOW this is basic tenet of your philosophy, my question was if murdering and robbing people would be a good strategy in a society with that philosophy. You know, YOUR society?

    But you can’t answer my questions can you? You deflect, insult, redirect. Duck and weave, duck and weave. That’s obviously YOUR strategy. It certainly is your generation’s strategy. Never answer a straight question. ‘Spin’ the news. You don’t need engineers to build a bridge, just a positive attitude that whatever you throw up will defy the laws of gravity through your positive thinking.

    Thanks for your concern about people ‘turning off’ from my whingeing, I’m touched. Truth is though, you keep replying. I guess you must be ‘pushing through the pain’.

    >> X: “What makes you think I will be sticking around here so I can pay 70% of my income in taxes …”

    >> Now that’s a good example. It’s difficult to imagine why a person with your extraordinarily-high IQ would pay 70% in taxation, when Australia initiated salary packaging / salary sacrifice over two decades ago. People like us, with average intelligence, quickly appreciated the days of PAYE victims paying up to 48% in tax were over.

    Oh right, your company didn’t pay FBT, so you worked for tax evaders. Nice. Was this when you were earning twice or three times the salary of your GenX subordinates. Or did you company practice age discrimination as well? No wait, you fired all of your GenX employees, and outsourced the jobs to India, then you paid yourself a big bonus. Am I warm?

    >> Please consider staying in Australia. Your threat to bankrupt Oz by taking your ponzi-super*… and depriving us forever of your higher intelligence… is unbearable. We _need_ people who can outthink fish.

    Sorry to disappoint you, but Australia is ALREADY bankrupt, regardless of whether I leave or not. It will only take a 3% contraction in GDP to trigger a default.
    At any rate, I can’t see how Australia would be deprived of my higher intelligence, because it has never had any use for it. Australia digs rocks out of the ground and sells them, like a true banana republic, it has no need or no use for intelligent people. In fact, one million intelligent and capable Australians have left Australia already, because Australia has no use for them.

    One million intelligent, educated people, who might have urged prudence over exuberance, or compassion over the greed and hatred you espouse against those you feel are not worthy.

    I’m not breaking any new ground by leaving here, I’m just calling you on your bullshit while I’m still here on behalf of those who have no political voice. Who have been excluded from the political process. I’m telling THEM, not you, how the game has been rigged against them. That they are not crazy or paranoid, there really are people out to take 100% of their income, either through debt or inflation or taxation.

    Your assertion that one can build the same asset base on 65K as one can on 180K in income is an absurdity, as is your claim that GenY face anything like the economic circumstances that GenX did. I know, I know, let’s not focus on the FACTS, because facts are irrelevant when you have a positive attitude, because once you have a positive attitude all you have to do is lie.

    Is this the subtle hint you are trying to give me? I should change my strategy and pretend I am a Baby Boomer? Should I try and buy a fake birth certificate pushing my date of birth back 15 years? I could always learn to ‘talk the talk’ of your generation. I know pathological dishonesty takes some practice, especially keeping the bile down, but I think I could do it. At least then I could get paid a BB salary, and there is no actual productive work involved, so it would be a lot less stressful.

    >> * The image I saw? TV sitcom scene with little kid with tiny suitcase standing by the door, angrily proclaiming “And I’m taking my piggybank, too.” Encore!~ ;)

    Cool story bro.

    Reply
  53. Round 804: ‘Dingggggg!!!!~’

    Biker” “As the year rolls on, we’ll look at more of your failed predictions.”
    X: “I know where you are going with that.”*

    OK, where do you think we are going, manwhoouthinkssoles’n’eels?

    * Didn’t think I’d let you off that easy, did you?! ;)

    Reply
  54. One of my comments above is still waiting on moderation. Once I know if I have been censored or not, I will return and reply.

    Reply
  55. My guess? You’ve been censored.

    You’re probably unaware that threats to kill are a little off, mate. ;)

    Missus wanted me to report you for it, but I advised her you’re all talk. :D

    Reply
  56. >> My guess? You’ve been censored.

    Mine too.

    >> You’re probably unaware that threats to kill are a little off, mate. ;)

    Good thing I never made one. Did this occur in an imaginary conversation you had in your head? You might want to go easy on the sauce mate.

    >> Missus wanted me to report you for it, but I advised her you’re all talk. :D

    Report me? To who? The thought police? Do they have those already? My the police state is progressing faster than I realised.

    Reply
  57. Amusing.

    Reply
  58. Well, as you stated that it’s a police state, for some reason she imagined you in a bloodied apron a la Mafia Wars…!~ ;)

    I told her your ‘police state’ comment probably resulted from a DUI…
    you know, pulled over after too much sauce… .

    Son, the conspiracy-against-your-generation stuff isn’t all that healthy.
    It’s the worst kind of cancer and it won’t improve your longevity at all.

    Reply
  59. >> Well, as you stated that it’s a police state, for some reason she imagined you in a bloodied apron a la Mafia Wars…!~

    I guess ‘reductio ad absurdum’ is probably lost on her. I simply took you assertion that you cannot blame others for anything to it’s logical absurdity. I know, it was a little subtle, I’ll try and ‘dumb it down’ a bit for you to prevent you and your wife’s brain from translating anything it doesn’t understand into trash TV images.

    >> I told her your ‘police state’ comment probably resulted from a DUI… you know, pulled over after too much sauce… .

    I’m sure that made her feel better. Ha ha, good one Biker. Oddly enough, I’ve never been charged with anything. I feel as though I’ve let the Aussie culture down somehow by that omission. I’m willing to bet you’ve been a good Aussie though.

    >> Son, the conspiracy-against-your-generation stuff isn’t all that healthy.

    You know when Potts and his conscripts did something that had never been done before i.e. halt the advance of the 20th century Japanese Army, they did it through a tactically brilliant staged retreat.
    So when Blamey got up on the parade stand and told them that ‘the rabbit that ran away is the rabbit that got shot’, they must have felt the way I feel listening to you.

    Some clueless, pampered, out of touch know it all, is telling ME what I experienced in life from the comfort of their armchair paid for by my sacrifices. And they are telling me that my experiences “on the ground”, are just a figment of my imagination, they never happened. More to the point, they are unhealthy!

    Well thanks for the advice Doc! How much is the whole home study course????

    >> It’s the worst kind of cancer and it won’t improve your longevity at all.

    As if I worry about my longevity. But thanks for wishing cancer on me mate.

    Reply
  60. Biker:
    Looks like my comment has been censored. So I’ll see if I can ask this one question. What company did you say you worked for that evaded taxes by not paying Fringe Benefits Tax on your salary sacrifice items?

    Reply
  61. X – You are arguing with a idiot.

    If you want to wind him up & His buddy Dogman come to the Perth Now Property site where Biker Pete lingers like a Fart in a Elevator.

    http://www.perthnow.com.au/business/property

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    June 17, 2011
    Reply
  62. I forgot to mention on the Perth Now Site he goes by the name of “Trav’s”

    But be warned this twit would deny the existence of gravity.

    Just swamp him with overwhelming verifiable facts & watch him either ignore them or come back with Motherhood Statements &Rhetoric.

    Remember you are dealing with a Mum -N – Dad investor who thinks he is earning 7% plus Tax Free on funds he places in a mortgage offset account.

    Village Idiot sums him up! But don’t be too hard on him just enjoy abusing him & watch him come back again & again.

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    June 17, 2011
    Reply
  63. X: “Oddly enough, I’ve never been charged with anything.”

    Rest assured, I advised her you were a man of no conviction whatsoever. :D

    X: “What company did you say you worked for that evaded taxes by not paying Fringe Benefits Tax on your salary sacrifice items?”

    Items? Salary only. Gawd, it’s no wonder you pay 70% taxation.
    Evaded taxes? FBT? Clearly, you’re clueless about financial matters. Normally, I’d advise a naif that no-one will safeguard one’s assets better than oneself, but in your case I’d advise you to find a really good accountant; or familiarise yourself with the tax laws of your new and subsequent boltholes.

    Keep up the inter-generational hatred and you wish cancer on yourself.
    As I’ve counselled before, you’re already unwell.

    No more free mentoring. It’s Lawrence’s turn… .
    Not making much progress there, either.
    What is it with you bears?!~ ;)

    *click*

    Reply
  64. Still trying to write an insult grammatically, N Fool?

    Look, here it is again:

    “You truly are a Oxygen Thief.”

    I refuse to believe you attended high school, son… .

    Very last chance.
    I’ll check with you before we travel north in the morning.
    See if you can nut it out overnight.
    Clue: You need to add an ‘N’ somewhere.
    Nope, not ‘thienf’, or ‘arne’, or ‘trunly’.
    Mate, this is your fifteen hours of fame: Go for it, N Fool!~ :D

    Reply
  65. >>Items? Salary only. Gawd, it’s no wonder you pay 70% taxation.
    >> Evaded taxes? FBT? Clearly, you’re clueless about financial matters.

    Still ducking and weaving?

    >> Normally, I’d advise a naif that no-one will safeguard one’s assets better than oneself, but in your case I’d advise you to find a really good accountant; or familiarise yourself with the tax laws of your new and subsequent boltholes.

    Well, I’m glad YOU evaded taxes, but none-the-less, the taxes were still paid, BY SOMEONE ELSE.

    Lets break down my future tax burden shall we.

    We’ll start with Gross income:

    32% effective marginal rate
    12% superannuation tax to pay for YOUR retirement, of which I wont see a dollar.
    5% medicare levy to pay for YOUR drugs.
    2% Flood/disaster/moron levy to pay for those too stupid to understand what a 100 year flood line is.

    So that’s 51% of my gross, and then the taxes on my NETT income.
    GST 10%
    Inflation 8%

    And that’s only the DIRECT taxes. If I were to accept your slavery and stay here my employer would also be paying Payroll Tax and Worker’s Compensation on my behalf. Oh, and then there is the proposed carbon tax added to the fuel excise, the proposed mandatory income insurance. Did I miss anything? Probably. I am, as you say, clueless in financial matters.

    But since I am clueless in financial matters, could you tell me what a credit spread is? Or how about the “carry trade”, what’s that?
    Also I heard that yesterday the Greek CDS spread went to 9000! 9000! I’m financially clueless, so I don’t know what that means, but it sounds bad. What do you think?

    >> Keep up the inter-generational hatred and you wish cancer on yourself. As I’ve counselled before, you’re already unwell.

    No hatred, just want my money back. But I am realistic. I don’t see the Kooris getting their land back, and they have been waiting 200 years.

    Reply
  66. You want your money back? You include inflation as a tax?
    Kooris? You figure that’s a generic term?

    No refunds, manwhoouthinksthefish*.

    Thank you for your valued contribution to our comfortable retirement.
    When the volcanic ash clears, you’ll be off to Greece, I expect.
    Don’t forget your piggybank… ;)

    * Thought you might have helped your blogsite genius mate…
    No wonder we call him ‘N’ Fool. :D

    Reply
  67. >> You include inflation as a tax?
    Inflation is the reduction of purchasing power through incompetent fiscal policy. Instead of raising money by collecting taxes, the government raises money by diluting the existing money supply, debasing it’s value. I would have thought a financial genius such as yourself would know that. So are you a financial genius? I need to know before I take any advice from you.

    >> Kooris? You figure that’s a generic term?
    Nope. I just figured it was the only tribe you knew, to keep it simple for you and the missus. Do you prefer ‘Melanesian who came across a land bridge 40,000 years ago’?

    >> When the volcanic ash clears, you’ll be off to Greece, I expect.

    Wow, you really fell for that hook, line and sinker didn’t you? Where I used to work we had a term for your kind of investor: pig, because you rush to the free-money trough to feed, but squeal when you get slaughtered.
    I guess the government will just have to keep bailing you out whenever you squeal in the future. Gee, I wonder who will pay for that.

    >> Don’t forget your piggybank… ;)

    Alas the legislation changed while I was overseas the previous time. There’s not much there, but it’s all yours. Enjoy it, *I* worked hard for it.

    >> Thank you for your valued contribution to our comfortable retirement.

    It wasn’t voluntary, so it wasn’t a contribution.

    >> manwhoouthinksthefish

    I see what you did there.

    >> * Thought you might have helped your blogsite genius mate…
    >> No wonder we call him ‘N’ Fool. :D

    Cool story bro.

    Reply
  68. Financial genius? Hardly… :D

    I know as much about credit spread and carry trade as you know about tax minimisation (as opposed to avoidance… Mr Google might help you there.)

    But I can see that your expertise in these matters has helped you very little. Sounds like your Super’s all you’ve got.

    You sound like you’re in a pretty bad way:

    * From the l-o-n-g list you’ve provided, it seems you may be correct about those conspiring against you. Some may suggest this is a phenomonen known as ‘paranoia’. They should be added to the list.

    * The need to run from the powerlessness and hopelessness you feel seems wholly justified, given the facts you’ve stated. Should anyone suggest you should confront your fears, call them animal names. For some reason, ‘pigs’ seems _highly_ appropriate. ;)

    * Your perception that those who disagree with you are on medication (how could anyone _disagree_ with your correct perception of your adopted country?) is probably spot on. Should a physician or psychologist dare to suggest that your world view is twisted or warped, denounce them. If they warn that self-harm is a likely outcome, produce your list, shouting “The Boomers in this fascist police state socialist government put you up to this, didn’t they???!!!”

    But seriously, do check out everything you can about the original home of Democracy, before you emigrate again. Particularly study their medical benefits system. There is _nothing_ surer than your need for full, free ongoing coverage…

    Reply
  69. Biker: OK, you didn’t get the last one:
    “You truly are a Oxygen Thief.”

    Let’s try your next one:
    N Fool: “You are arguing with a idiot”

    BOTH these insults are less-than-effective.

    What is _similar_ about them?
    What letter is missing? Which word is _changed_?
    (Repeat all the steps from yesterday.
    Tell us _tomorrow morning_
    before we resume our trip…. .)

    Reply
  70. This reminds me of an episode of Mythbusters I saw recently about shooting fish in a barrel.

    Ah Biker, for Entree we had your dishonesty.
    Main Course, your ignorance of finance and economics (in contrast to your boastful claim of expertise).

    Before desert though, lets address a few of your claims.

    >> I know as much about credit spread and carry trade as you know about tax minimisation (as opposed to avoidance… Mr Google might help you there.)

    You seem to believe that because you ‘minimized’ (i.e. didn’t pay) your taxes, that the taxes themselves never got paid. In fact, you probably never gave it much thought as to who ended up with the bill for all the taxes you ‘minimized’. While you and your fellow financial geniuses were minimizing your taxes, the Australian government was collecting more taxes (both notional and as a percentage of GDP) than it any other time in Australian history.
    Don’t you find that a bit odd? Does the math add up? The country’s largest demographic in history was busily minimizing their tax burden, and yet the government STILL managed to increase the tax base to an all time record. It seems that all the taxes you ‘minimized’ were in fact paid by someone else!
    Of course, to you, any reference to FACTS or ACTUAL DATA published by the government themselves is simply further EVIDENCE of my paranoia. Right?

    >> But I can see that your expertise in these matters has helped you very little. Sounds like your Super’s all you’ve got.

    I don’t know why you keep insisting that I HAVE super. I don’t. I have an account in a Ponzi scheme that I can’t access before those at the top of the pyramid withdraw all of the money. To claim otherwise is just dishonest.

    >> (how could anyone _disagree_ with your correct perception of your adopted country?)

    Ah yes, again with the completely erroneous accusation that I am an immigrant. I guess you are playing the race card for the peanut gallery right? Blowing on the dingo whistle? You’ve gone on that fruitless fishing expedition three times now and come up empty. Perhaps you should dig deeper into your demagogues bag of tricks. Or is that all you have? Perhaps you could try calling me a communist, or a gypsy?

    >> But seriously, do check out everything you can about the original home of Democracy, before you emigrate again.

    You still haven’t figured out that I am not going to Greece??!!! Oh god, please stop, my sides are hurting. I think that is a perfect segway into dessert, which is a parable about something called the bell curve.

    This parable is about a company named Long Term Capital Management. Being the expert in all matters financial and economic, you no doubt know all about LTCM, but if you will humour me for a minute while I repeat this cautionary tale, you will have my gratitude.

    LTCM was founded by a man called John Meriwether, who is incidental to the tale. The real ‘genius’ behind the firm was Myron Scholes and Robert C. Merton, joint Nobel Prize winners in economics. Merton and Scholes big idea was this: that the price movements in financial markets (and most probably all markets) fit to a ‘log normal distribution’. i.e. a bell curve, and they built an options trading strategy based on that theory.

    At first, it looked as though the theory was correct, and there was much rejoicing. LTCM was on track to be the fastest growing financial services company in history. With 40% annual returns it wasn’t long, they had 7 billion under management. I mean, these guys had discovered the secret of free money, why wouldn’t you invest with them?

    And then, something happened. A communist state on the other side of the world defaulted on it’s debts. To Merton and Scholes however this event was so far removed from anything they understood that they assumed that it’s effect on US financial markets would be negligible. Both had been brought up in prosperous Western economies, attended good schools, worked in white shoe, establishment investment banks. In other words, their whole lives they hadn’t had much contact with something the rest of the population knew as REALITY.

    But the Russian default DID effect prices on US financial markets, and before LTCM could adapt, they were already 4.5 billion in the whole. They went cap in hand to George Soros, a man who had spent his childhood in REALITY. He declined to help out. Eventually the banking establishment put together a rescue package and they were absorbed into Goldman Sachs.

    The lesson of the parable is three fold:
    1. You can be successful financially, even when you are 100% wrong about how you got there.
    2. Reality can intervene on even the best laid plans created by the smartest minds.
    3. In the age of globalisation, events in far off countries, thousands of miles away can have surprising and unexpected consequences on your investment strategy.

    The good news is: your kids own bonds, so after taking a haircut, they will at least still have a cash flow.
    The bad news is, your other asset classes are overweight, over leveraged and over priced, and when you go to market to stem the carnage and cut your losses, there I will be, the buyer of last resort.

    Reply
  71. Haven’t got long before we’re off again, so let’s cover the serious, life-changing stuff first!~ :D

    No progress, N Fool?

    Perhaps an example demonstrating correct usage may help:

    “N Fool is an oik.”

    Now, compare this to your two recent insults:

    “You truly are a Oxygen Thief…”

    ….and….

    ” You are a idiot…”

    Here’s the good bit. You get to sing it:

    http://www.metrolyrics.com/one-of-these-things-is-not-like-the-others-lyrics-sesame-street.html

    Now, where’s the other kid? ;)

    Reply
  72. @X The “mafia wars” and “Ah yes, again with the completely erroneous accusation that I am an immigrant.” are probably his suspicions that you are or might be me posting under a new name.. Which you and I know at least is not the case as I know I am not you and you are not me.

    I have been busy getting 1 business of the ground and renovating another so have not really concerned myself with too much commenting on the site.

    Stillgotshoeson
    June 18, 2011
    Reply
  73. X I warned you you are arguing with a idiot & oxygen thief.

    Starve a fire of oxygen & it goes out.

    But by all means come to the Perth Now property site & play with him like a cat with a mouse.

    The fool gets bitch slapped daily but somehow thinks he is winning the argument?

    He uses various tags to hide his true identity: Trav’s , RTW Traveller, Dogman, Oldbutok, Bill, Rational Thought,to name a few

    The trick is to poke him with facts , then sit back & watch him go off like a “Frog in a Sock”.

    But be warned you will be at the “Shallow End Of the Gene Pool” so bring your floaties.

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    June 18, 2011
    Reply
  74. Jeez, I didn’t mean to keep you up all night, ‘X’.
    (You could learn something from this bloke, N Fool!~)

    Desert? Quite a few more kilometres north, genius! ;)

    X: “…further EVIDENCE of my paranoia. Right?”

    Right. It’s your tendency to generalise and stereotype that gives it away.
    Thus all Baby Boomers are evil, all governments conspire against you, all Aboriginals are Koori.

    Your Super? Let’s review your statement (16th June 2011):
    X: “I’ll be taking my superannuation with me too.”
    Alzheimers in one so young? I’d chuck the aluminium cookware, son. :D

    My references to Greece? Simply thought the current climate there might appeal to your optimistic nature. You know, candlelit cocktails in the evening… probably launching them at government buildings, authority figures, that sort-of-thing… .

    Gotta go! I’ve marked where I’m up to with an ‘X’. You write such long epissles… and my better half wonders why I even bother to try to assist you. “It’s Men’s Health Week!” I respond, winking, as the dessert calls…. :D

    Reply
  75. @Stillgotshoeson
    That’s probably the logical explanation. Either that or he is the inspiration for the new upcoming movie sequel “Dumberer and Mindbogglingly Stupider”.

    @Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    “Frog in a Sock” – I like it. Be patient, we haven’t got to Supper yet.

    Reply
  76. Biker: “Better Half” = code for “Life Partner?

    Greece: Toga parties & getting it “Greek Style”
    from before mentioned “Life partner” ?

    X you can look forward to “Trav’s” aka “Biker Pete” fantasy travel all done with the aid of Google.

    Did the same thing in 2009 on Perth now site then I exposed him with the times he was posting in Canada was 2 AM , 3 AM & 4AM local time but he was engaging in discussions with people in OZ. (This Dip$hit is incapable of getting the simplest things right)

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    June 18, 2011
    Reply
  77. @Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype

    I’m waiting to see if he wants to be served supper as I am keeping it warm for him.
    Maybe he saw this article today and had a ‘pants accident’:
    http://theage.domain.com.au/real-estate-news/the-home-that-no-one-will-buy-20110604-1fmid.html
    Good lord, you know when The Age, the staunchest champion of Howard’s Happy Home Heroes, prints an article like this that something is rotten in the state of Denmark. Particularly enjoyable are the comments from the Real Estate agents quoted in article.

    But I think he will be back to ‘assist’ me correct the error of my ways.

    Reply
  78. HaHa..! I see the Birds-of-a-Feather are, at last, working together. :D

    N Fool: “I exposed him with the times he was posting in Canada was 2 AM , 3 AM & 4AM”

    You exposed yourself, as usual, DH. Challenged on this, you declined to proceed with a large bet on the matter, involving my passport. Further exposed yourself as a chronic liar on the issue of your claimed attendance at an auction you later confessed you hadn’t attended… and your claimed ownership of six investment properties you later admitted you’d lied about. Doubt ANY this, folks? Ask for the _links_ as proof.

    Yes, we’re back, ‘X’. Missed your daily serve, did you? Hope you haven’t been venting at your dependents instead… .

    Let’s review two very recent statements you’ve made here:

    X: “Already done. I’ll be taking my superannuation with me too.”
    X: “I don’t know why you keep insisting that I HAVE super. I don’t. I have an account in a Ponzi scheme that I can’t access before those at the top of the pyramid withdraw all of the money.”

    Care to explain this?

    Here’s my theory. You have very little or nothing. Like N Fool, you feel it necessary to lie about this. In his case, he claims six investment properties. LIE. Exercising a fabrication that you’ll take something of value when _you_ leave Oz, you threaten “I’ll be taking my superannuation with me too…” LIE. Presented with the image of the little kid and his tiny suitcase whimpering “…and I’m taking my piggybank too… “ you quickly retract. You blokes really are birds-of-a-feather! ;)

    And so it is with liars. All you needed was a little rope. :D

    I fully understand your hatred of the Baby Boomer generation, though. What you need to do is _focus_ the hatred a little. Direct it at the very individuals responsible for your pain… those who promised you first a 40% discount on a home… and more recently a 70% discount. Like Shoes’ five forecasts for 2011, we’re sure to see these silly promises come to fruition soon. ;)

    Reply
  79. Comment by Biker on 19 June 2011:

    Like Shoes’ five forecasts for 2011, we’re sure to see these silly promises come to fruition soon. ;)

    I do believe it is 6 not 5 and you have conceded elsewhere that I have got 1 right.

    Maybe you should post them up for all to see…

    Stillgotshoeson
    June 19, 2011
    Reply
  80. Shoes: “I do believe it is 6 not 5 and you have conceded elsewhere that I have got 1 right.”

    Link, please.

    Shoes: “Maybe you should post them up for all to see… ”

    Just over six months to go, son.

    Don’t sweat it. ;)

    Reply
  81. Ah Biker, I was getting worried there, thought you might have cut your losses and run. But no, you are back for another serving. I guess this is because you are a glutton (for punishment) and will swallow any bait I throw out.

    So now it’s time for your supper (or should I say super ;) ).

    So far I’ve been taking it easy on you. I did this despite the fact that I think you are a liar and a fool. Despite the fact that I think you are 100% wrong on almost everything you think you know, and despite the fact that I think your kids, much as they love their old man, are enormously relieved that they no longer have to listen your constant self-congratulation and pop-tart psychology.

    No. The reason I have been taking it easy on you is because I have come to the opinion that your behavior is not the result of malicious intent. You _really_ do believe they nonsense you espouse, and it’s easy to see why: you have become a perfect clone of everything the social engineers and policy wonks in the department of the treasury in Canberra for the last 40 years imagined you could be.

    Your whole ‘learning journey of discovery’, which you think was some amazing piece of financial detective work on your part, was actually a series of collisions with economic behavioral incentives dumped along the path you were on. Incentives marked with a big flashing neon sign with the words ‘Free Money’ inscribed in large friendly green letters.

    Let’s see if, using Canberra’s economic blueprint for your life, and my estimate that you are roughly in the middle of the bell curve, and see if I can map out your financial journey to retirement.

    Your financial journey has been, in the main, a series of economic incentives that have primarily taken the form of tax minimization/concessions. I am going to focus on three of those, and I will make my best guess as to the order you ‘discovered’ them in.

    First, you discovered salary packaging. And if you are like 70% of people who used salary packaging (and I am guessing you are), the item you packaged up was a car. Now you probably didn’t stop to think why 70% of salary packaging was automobiles, or even why more than 50% of those automobiles were fleet cars. And you most likely never wondered why fleet vehicles mysteriously always seemed to be overpriced sedans assembled in Australia by companies staffed by the hopelessly inept, malevolently unproductive or grossly overpaid. So you probably never realized that one man’s tax minimization scheme is another man’s ‘perennially-hopeless-auto-industry subsidy’ scheme.

    Next you discovered the dual subsidy of negative gearing/capital gains tax exemption. You were exempt from CGT for your owner occupied house, and the government helped you pay off the mortgage on your investment properties with negative gearing against your income. At the time you probably didn’t think too much about why the government would give you an incentive to allocate economic capital to housing stock rather than … say … cheese factories, you just took your ‘free’ money from the government and jumped right in. Barely noticing the mortgage book of Australian banks growing to 110% of GDP while cheese factories were closing up shop all over the country.
    (You also may not have noticed that the First Home Owners Grant ends up in the pocket of the _seller_ of the property, not the _buyer_)

    On the last leg of your ‘bilking the Commonwealth as an investment strategy’ journey, you discovered the hidden magic of topping up your super (or should I say supper ;) ). In the early days of super, it went in untaxed, but successive governments have changed that. Still even with the current caps and rates, the tax rate is still a significant discount over the PAYG rate. I guess you probably haven’t given much thought to capital flows in the economic system. Nor have you likely pondered the asset class requirements for Australian super funds. And I think last on your list of ruminations is why Australia, with a trillion dollar economy, has no Growth Enterprise Market.

    So here we are, at the end of your ‘learning journey’. You are long on every asset class Canberra wanted you to be long on. You could have taken a haircut in 87, 93, 97, 03 or 08, but Canberra stepped in each and every time and backed your (their) play. The most recent time was when they lent their sovereign debt rating to the banks so they didn’t have to take a 50 basis point margin compression (I’m sure the meaning of that last sentence escapes you).

    How did I do?

    Now that is all well and good. You saw the flashing neon signs and you jumped in, if the government was going to bankroll your investments, why the h3ll not?

    But the real question here is, with so many enthusiastic BBs ‘getting with the program’ of using the Commonwealth to bankroll their investments, how on earth did the Commonwealth pay for all this pork?

    Hmmm … you complain that my posts are too long. Maybe I should serve the answer to that one with Port and a Cigar.

    Reply
  82. And just a little side dish.

    >> X: “Already done. I’ll be taking my superannuation with me too.”
    >> X: “I don’t know why you keep insisting that I HAVE super. I don’t.
    >> I have an account in a Ponzi scheme that I can’t access before those
    >> at the top of the pyramid withdraw all of the money.”

    >> Care to explain this?

    Smoke test. You passed.

    I’m going to take a wild guess and say that you came to the internet _after_ the heydays of usenet. You have to develop ways to test for trolls, flamebaiters and astroturfers, particularly astroturfers. One thing to check for is whether the person follows assertions from post to post.
    Trolls and flamebaiters will do so to some degree, but astroturfers tend to ignore everything you say, like politicians ignore questions from media interviewers and go on to read a prepared statement.

    Other tests I gave you:
    Honesty test: You failed. You quoted me out of context three times (lie of omission).
    Intelligence test: You scored just above average.
    Conformance test: You like to fit into the heir-achy of your peers, but you probably see yourself as the beta male of the group.

    I also introduced deliberate errors into my posts. You picked up about 30% of the simple ones, but none that could be debunked in about 5 minutes of searching with Google.
    For example, Greek Credit Default Swap spread peaked at 1900. I used the number 9000 because it is a joke number from nerd culture. Because you didn’t bother to debunk that number, I learned two things. 1) If some knowledge is way beyond your understanding, you wont spend 5 minutes researching it, even to score a cheap point in a forum ‘debate’ and 2) The likelihood of you being a Baby Boomer rather than a simple troll greatly increased. Of course, you could be an extremely clever troll that knows exactly how to respond AS IF you are a baby boomer. One can never know for certain. Which is essentially the lesson I am trying to impart to anyone reading my posts: That it is very difficult to be certain about anything.

    Reply
  83. X: “Smoke test. You passed.”

    Yes, N Fool made almost the same comment when _he_ was caught out.

    Lie detection: You failed.

    *Screenshot*

    Reply
  84. Biker: *Screenshot*

    Aw sweetie, ragequit already? Didn’t even make it to Port and Cigar!

    Biker: Lie detection: You failed.

    Well yes, I lied, but I did so for a reason. You see mate, everyone lies. That someone lied is not all that interesting, what is interesting is the type of lies they tell.

    For example, people who are very smart tend to use sophistry to lie. I myself use it often, but the lie I fed you about my super wasn’t a lie of sophistry, it was a lie with a very specific purpose. Personally I know the lies I tell, both to others, and to myself.

    You, on the other hand, tell lies of omission. Generally this is a lie told by people who are more cunning than intelligent.

    By observing how you lie I could tell that even though you are of average intelligence, you are quite cunning. You are the sort of person who will find a deal, see a bargain and jump right on top of any source of free money, especially when it is being handed out by the government. This gives you a sort of street-smarts, but it also makes you think you are smarter than other people, because you measure intelligence by success in the material world. To you, a bloke with 3 houses and 10 cars is smarter than some poor fella living in a flat solving the world’s future energy problems. (No claims, just using an example).

    Lies of omission are also often instinctive, reactive lies. The ego feels threatened and lashes out to protect it’s self image. Normally it takes a long time to find someone’s hot buttons, but I didn’t feel like spending the next month finding out what yours were, so I made some assumptions and poked around pretty hard.

    Despite all that, I’ve tried at least three times to enlighten you as to what was going on, and yet you failed utterly to comprehend. This is not due to intelligence, and it’s not due to an inability to adapt (cunning), so I can only conclude that it must be irredeemable egotism. An absolute refusal to listen to anyone else because you know everything already.

    Since you are not sticking around for Port and Cigar, let me conclude by saying that I don’t hate Baby Boomers. Irritated by them sometimes yes, bored by them often and sometimes sent into eye rolling disbelief by them, but not hate. Most of the time I find them pretty funny. A generation of anti-establishment anti-war hippies that turned into the most grasping, greedy war mongers since the mercantile age. Ha ha, talk about turning into everything you fought against in your youth.

    I should also say that I am eternally grateful to your generation for the education I received. You fought for greater access to Higher Education, and even though you did it for your kids and not for me, I was still the beneficiary, and for that I thank you. The two great ironies of my life are:
    1) that my generation ended up 3 times as educated as you, thanks to your efforts and
    2) that despite our higher education we get paid up to 80% less to do the same job as you, and you get paid at least 100% more than _YOUR_ managers did (relative to you) as you were coming up through the workforce.
    Still, I think the first balances the second out, but it is still irritating when you won’t even acknowledge it.

    Happy Trails.
    :)

    Reply
  85. Well said X

    You have the patience of a saint, remember this man will argue the existence of Gravity!

    Biker:

    If we were watching a WWF match this would be referred to as a “SMACKDOWN”

    I bet you can’t wait for the RBA to raise interest rates so that you can channel more funds into your Offset Accounts so that you can “Earn” even greater amounts “Tax Free” { You are without doubt a world class Dip$hit !!! }

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    June 20, 2011
    Reply
  86. I didn’t bother to read any further than “Yes, I lied.”

    Shall we dismantle the rest of your fantasy life?

    X: “Bleak? Ha! What makes you think I will be sticking around _here_…”(?)

    X: “…when you go to market to stem the carnage and cut your losses, _there_ I will be, the buyer of last resort.”

    Here? There? Which is the lie?

    Yes, ‘bleak’ must describe you three galahs pretty well. How desperate must your _real_ lives be to need to continually fabricate these imaginary, successful personas? Was this tendency spawned in your early years? Is it something you encourage in your _own_ children?

    Reply
  87. >> I didn’t bother to read any further than “Yes, I lied.”

    Good for you! On reflection I think the medicine may have been a little strong for your constitution anyway.

    On a side topic, remember that episode of Mythbusters I mentioned earlier about shooting fish in a barrel? Well, apparently, you don’t even have to hit the fish! When the bullet hits the water, a shock wave propagates out to the sides of the barrel, which, being elliptical, act as a lens, pummeling any fish inside the barrel and making them float to the top. I only mention this by way of thanking you for volunteering to be the fish!

    >> Shall we dismantle the rest of your fantasy life?

    Oh dear. Here’s a tip for you. Don’t ever give anyone even or better odds on what you will do next.

    >> Here? There? Which is the lie?

    Addressing the cognitive dysfunction in the temporal lobe of your brain will have to wait for my next post. For now I will serve you Port and Cigar to see if we can’t help you digest the supper I served up earlier.

    So, where were we? A yes, Canberra’s economic plan, and your participation in it.
    At this point in our narrative, Canberra’s economic plan is, by their own measure, a spectacular success. Thanks to you, and other cunning linguists whoknowhowtospelldessert like you, the state of the Australian economy in the 21st century looks like this:
    – The roads are full of $h177y, overpriced gas guzzlers, but the auto industry is about 50% of the way into it’s restructuring.
    – “Four pillar” mortgage book totals 110% of GDP, and house prices are at 6.8 times median income, almost as high as Japan before the lost decades.
    – And lastly, P/E ratios on index equities are stratospheric due to an ever increasing amount of capital chasing a fixed amount of equity.

    Problem is, it was very expensive for the Commonwealth to implement this plan, both in tax revenues, and the effect it had on the velocity of money through the economy. So how then is it that despite these massive outflows, the Commonwealth still managed to collect a record amount of tax income?

    The answer lies in recent studies done on the spending patterns of people as a function of their age. Notice I said _spending_ and not _consumption_.

    As you would expect, young children, while they do EAT ice-cream, don’t actually BUY ice-cream. The age at which children begin spending their own income is of course highly variable in history, but if we restrict our historical horizon to post war only we can see that your generation began spending early, due to a Higher Education retention rate of about 12-15%.

    My generation began spending later, due to a HE retention rate of between 22-30% and economic circumstance I describe below >>

    Your kids actually began spending earlier than my generation, due to different economic conditions. When I was finishing High School,the great ‘recession we had to have’ was in full swing. In my city alone the steelworks laid off 10,000 workers. Workers who were back in the job market looking for a job. (Actually, a large percentage of them were happy to collect the dole, drink beer and watch TV. Sure beat working with hot steel all day.) When _your_ kids finished High School, the economy was humming along at almost full employment, thanks in part to lower paid, higher producing GenXers entering the workforce (and Hawke/Keating macroeconomic reform, enterprise bargaining and so on).

    But spending patterns of teenagers and early 20s are not that interesting, because almost all of their spending is on themselves. It’s only when people start having their own children that we begin to appreciate the difference between _spending_ and _consumption_.
    As I mentioned before, my children _consume_ ice-cream (I don’t), but they don’t _spend_ money to obtain ice-cream. I do that.

    When children _leave_ home, their parent’s spending habits change dramatically, as I am sure you noticed when yours got their wings and flew the coop.

    So now we come to the most egregious economic lie ever told. A lie that’s been repeated by every media outlet and every economist. The lie is that the Goods and Services Tax (GST) is a CONSUMPTION tax, when in fact it is a SPENDING tax. It taxes you every time you purchase nappies, or ice cream, or school uniforms, or text books, and on every other purchase as well.

    So you can see that in order to understand who paid the greatest portion of their income in GST, you need to determine
    a) When it was introduced (the year) and
    b) Who was the target demographic in the ‘spending vs age’ bell curve?

    I’m not going to spell out the answers to that for you. I know the other people reading this know the answer to both (1) and (2).

    So that concludes our degustation. I know some of it was hard to swallow, and I apologize for making you wait at the bar for a table while I fed you cheap drinks.

    I’m going to defrost some chicken for dinner. When I return later tonight, assuming that your missus hasn’t reported me to the RSPCA for cruelty to fish, I will try and help you with that cognitive dysfunction in your temporal lobe.

    Happy Trails
    :)

    Reply
  88. X: “Addressing the cognitive dysfunction in the temporal lobe of your brain will have to wait for my next post. For now I will serve you Port and Cigar to see if we can’t help you digest the supper I served up earlier.”

    I read _just_ that far… .

    Watch a browser in a bookshop sometime. Picks up a book. Reads the first few paragraphs. Puts it down.

    Regardless of whether it’s fact or fiction, he puts it down.
    Picks another up. Scans. Buys it…

    Your story doesn’t sell. It smells. I mean you really *pong* !
    Hope you don’t spend any quality time writing your fiction, son.

    Back to brass tacks:

    ‘Here’ or ‘There’?
    This will pursue you until you respond.
    I’m very patient… in no rush at all.
    You pop up and we’ll revisit the two completely different claims, OK? ;)

    Reply
  89. >> Note also that I ceased reading your angry rant
    >> I didn’t bother to read any further than “Yes, I lied.”
    >> I read _just_ that far… .
    >> Your story doesn’t sell. It smells.

    What story? You’ve only managed the read the first paragraph of almost everything I wrote.

    It’s hard to imagine you are actually this dense.

    Alright, last shot, see if I can get through.

    >>Shall we dismantle the rest of your fantasy life?
    >> X: “Bleak? Ha! What makes you think I will be sticking around _here_…”(?)
    >>X: “…when you go to market to stem the carnage and cut your losses, _there_ I will be, the buyer of last resort.”
    >>Here? There? Which is the lie?

    The difference between earning an income and purchasing financial assets is that earning an income is constrained by temporal constraints. That is, only so many days in the week, so many weeks in the year, so many years until retirement. Hence it makes sense to maximize your income to go to a country that (a) Pays you the market rate for your knowledge and skills and (b) lets you keep the maximum of your earnings after tax. I have done this 4 times already. Once in the US and three times in Asia. I was well paid in the US, but heavily taxed. I was also well paid in Asia, but lightly taxed.

    Purchasing assets on the other hand do not have temporal constraints (except death, but that constrains everything). I can purchase assets in Australia at any time,from anywhere in the world, the only constraint is the price. I *personally* believe that assets in Australia are over priced, and will eventually correct as soon as the government stops interfering in the financial markets OR when the markets go ‘bidless’, and there is nothing the government can do to prop them up. (Bidless means that the market runs out of buyers).

    If you had bothered to read what I had written above, I wouldn’t need to be spelling it out like I was talking to a 10 year old, but you didn’t, so hear I am, pissing in the wind after all the smart people on this forum already know what I said.

    For YOU though, your asset purchasing program DEPENDED on you earning an income in Australia, because it was entirely predicated on tax minimization/concessions offered by the Australian government. I’m not saying there is anything wrong with that strategy on PERSONAL level for YOU. I am merely bringing to your attention the effect it has had on financial markets and asset class investment IN AUSTRALIA AS A WHOLE.

    No man’s assets are an island. They depend on the economic environment that they live in. You think your asset classes are safe, good for you. I have a different opinion. In an efficient market, unencumbered by government intervention, I would be able to take my short position against you. Unfortunately, that is currently NOT the state of Australian financial markets, and hence I have to bide my time until it is.

    Now, let’s address your closet xenophobia which manifests itself as a ‘Love it or leave it’ attitude. I COULD earn an income in Australia. Apart from having to live side by side with certain types of bores, it’s a beautiful country and still a great place to raise children. But as I have stated above so many times I’ve lost count, I would pay a very heavy financial price to do so. Not only would my salary be MUCH lower than in Asia or Europe, but I would face an ever increasing tax burden as your generation approaches the finishing line of retirement. BECAUSE …

    Your whole generation’s retirement strategy is predicated on two asset classes: real estate and blue chip index equities. Let’s examine the performance of those two asset classes since the end of the second world war shall we? There have been numerous real estate bubbles in that time. Your attention span is short, so lets just stick to the two most spectacular: The Japanese Asset Bubble, and the US Subprime Collapse.

    At the height of the Japanese Asset Bubble, real estate in downtown Tokyo topped out at US$93,000 per square foot! Three generation mortgages were common. Japans equity market, the Nikkei, topped out at 38,957.44 in December 1989. I invite you to look up what it is today, nearly 22 years later! (http://www.marketwatch.com/investing/index/nik?countryCode=JP)

    Next the 2008 US SubPrime collapse. Some time in 2007 the Dow topped out at around 15,000 before collapsing to under 7500 in early 2009. The only thing that saved it was the injection of over 1.4 trillion dollars into financial markets by the Federal Reserve, which took the US debt to a massive 14 trillion dollars. Despite this massive liquidity injection, 1 in 4 US mortgages are STILL underwater (i.e. the house price is lower than the loan value).

    I know, I know. Australia is DIFFERENT. Immune to Chinese commodity demand, and everything else.

    NOT!!!!!

    I think this is overcooked now. I was going for rare, but now it is overdone.

    Reply
  90. X: “What story?”

    Your story:

    X: “Bleak? Ha! What makes you think I will be sticking around _here_…”(?)

    X: “…when you go to market to stem the carnage and cut your losses, _there_ I will be, the buyer of last resort.”

    Here? There? Which is the lie?

    FIRST you assert that Bad Ol’ Oz has conspired against you (from the very day you were born, it seems! :D ) You’re leaving!!!!!
    (And taking your fictional piggybank!!! ;) )

    NEXT (even before the piggybank disappears in a puff of ‘smoke’) you’re not only staying, you’re buying property with both hands! (A Biker Wannabe if there ever was one… . HaHa… :) )

    So which is the lie, ‘X’?

    Give him the Really Bad News, N Fool. It may take _months_ but eventually you’ll admit that ONE of these ‘stories’ is a lie. Or you could simply morph… and disappear. Tied to his silly blogsite, NF couldn’t! :D :D :D

    Reply
  91. @Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype

    I think I’ve passed the point of diminishing returns here.

    You wrote: You have the patience of a saint, remember this man will argue the existence of Gravity!

    Well, I think _argue_ is too strong a word. That would imply some kind of neurological process going on upstairs. Certainly he would _deny_ there was gravity, if it meant the house was going to fall down.

    >> I bet you can’t wait for the RBA to raise interest rates so that you can channel more funds into your Offset Accounts so that you can “Earn” even greater amounts “Tax Free”

    You mean to say Biker doesn’t own his property free and clear. He is still leveraged?????. Oh my, he really is scr3wd.

    @Biker

    So this is your strategy of last resort? Make the same false accusations and ask the same questions again and again?

    I answered your question above. Whether you were too stupid to understand it, or whether it frightened you, or whether you are just a belligerent moron with nothing better to do is of no concern to me.

    You see, you STILL don’t understand. YOU WERE NEVER MY AUDIENCE. I’m not sure how you could be so dense as to miss that, but there you go.

    By the way, this was where you peaked:
    >> “The Boomers in this fascist police state socialist government put you up to this, didn’t they???!!!”

    I got a good laugh from that one, but sadly, it was your best work. It was all downhill after that.

    Seeya later, Scary Pete.

    Reply
  92. @Stillgotshoeson

    Thanks for chiming in with the source of the mistaken identity.

    Best of luck with your business endeavors. Just remember that the hardest part about doing business in Australia is managing your staff.
    Take a look at Biker for a fairly typical idea of the nightmare some Australians can be.

    Reply
  93. X: “Bleak? Ha! What makes you think I will be sticking around _here_…”(?)

    X: “…when you go to market to stem the carnage and cut your losses, _there_ I will be, the buyer of last resort.”

    Here? There? Which is the lie?

    M-a-t-e, you’re HERE, you’re THERE… you’re everywhere!~ :D

    (Didn’t think you’d stick around. Pity. It would have been lots of fun watching you wading through ‘the carnage’, transparent piggybank in hand, the liar of last retort… . ;) )

    Reply
  94. Biker: Word man, word.

    Reply
  95. The brighter they _think_ they are, the faster they burn out… .

    Never mind the Three Bears, ‘X’, your forebears lasted much longer.
    (Whatever happened to Claytonator, Bearamundi and NV? FIZZzzzz… . ;) )

    And where’s N Fool?

    NF: “Go away and don’t reply to anything I post from here on in and I promise to leave you alone as well.” October 14, 2009….

    and:

    NF: “Hey Travs forget about me it is not about me …. why make me the centre of your focus …” December 04, 2010.

    C’mon, ‘X’, don’t bail on us now! N Fool (caught out in _numerous_ bear-faced lies) is still clocking on. Mine Dew, he’s shackled to that
    incredible 1200h.p.d blogsite, so he could hardly morph into history… :D

    Reply
  96. Biker it is amusing that you still confuse Punter with me?

    FYI Had Lunch with Today Tonight crew on the weekend. Keep a eye out they are putting together another property falling story.

    As are the Tick Tick Tick people.

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    June 21, 2011
    Reply
  97. Biker: Note also that I ceased reading
    Biker: I didn’t bother to read any further
    Biker: I read _just_ that far… .

    Translation: Not only am I a moron, I’m also lazy.

    Biker: I’m very patient… in no rush at all.

    Translation: I’ve got five years until I’m eligible for parole.

    Biker: M-a-t-e

    Translation: I was spanking the monkey when I wrote that.

    Biker: (Didn’t think you’d stick around. Pity. It would have been lots of fun watching you wading through ‘the carnage’, transparent piggybank in hand, the liar of last retort… )

    Translation: I’m a sociopath and a blight on society. My eventual passing will be the only contribution I make to my society and my species. One day in the distant future, millions of people will read my obituary and, gratitude welling up in their hearts, will spontaneously come out into the streets, dancing and celebrating. The nightly news will mark the event as the best economic news in a century marked by rampant theft, corporate fraud and horrendous capital flight.


    Biker: Mine Dew

    Translation: I cough a lot.

    Anything else?

    Reply
  98. @Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype

    Just to let you know, I really enjoyed this one:

    >> Biker: “Better Half” = code for “Life Partner?
    >> Greece: Toga parties & getting it “Greek Style”
    from before mentioned “Life partner” ?

    Aha aha aha.

    Reply
  99. Oh Biker, one more thing. When you use your socket puppet accounts to vote down other people’s posts, you might want to mix it up a bit, instead of voting them all down EXACTLY 3 times each. LOL. It would seem that your stupidity is only exceeded by your stupidity.

    Reply
  100. Going? Coming?
    Coming? Going?
    What a clever bear…
    There? Here?
    Here? There?
    ‘X’ is everywhere! :D

    Reply
  101. Man … that was intense.

    First Biker was like nooooo, and then X was like huh?, and then Biker was all like yeah, but X was like ‘whoa’, but Biker was all bored and stuff, so X kept tryin and shizz, but Biker was all ‘I’m so good and you’re not n stuff’ and X was like dude! And then it ended.

    B0ng on dudes!

    Reply
  102. HaHa… . Five stars, Jason!~

    Yeah, you’re right. I should have been more responsive.
    I should have listened more carefully… and mentored him gently when he went astray.

    It’s difficult, ya know. Published poet and writer creates a special, very personal poem for him… and what do I get? Ignored! *sob* :(

    OK, in a new spirit of listening and responding, I’ll attempt to answer his last few X-rated comments:

    “Biker: M-a-t-e”
    Translation: I was spanking the monkey when I wrote that.
    Biker: M-a-t-e, the stuff that comes outa your mouth! ;)

    X: “I’m a sociopath and a blight on society.”
    Biker: Well, my missus thinks you’re a psychopath, but I’d agree with your self-diagnosis. “Why do you bother with that (insert L-word here)?
    OK, Lost Soul is a close-enough and kinder euphemism.

    The cheering-in-the-streets was a nice touch. Hadn’t realised the general population was so averse to my rhymes. :D

    X: “When you use your socket puppet accounts to vote…”
    Biker: Whoaaa! That sounds promising! What are ‘socket puppet accounts’?
    Now, remember, I’m the one with the 95 – 105 IQ… and you’re the rocket scientist, so take it step-by-step, nice’n’slow. If we get this right I can go back and ZAPPpp Shoes, who is far too popular for my liking!~ :D :D

    Reply
  103. Biker, no way dude. You totally nailed that a$$ clown. He’s gone.

    Hey man, check this out:
    Im an apprentice, pay is sh!t but payin rent is for stooges. Got the Yamaha from the fuzzies (sorry mate), so gettin to work is no problem. I dont p1ss away me wages at the boozer. Sometimes a couple with the boys, nothin big. Im trying to save up for a deposit to buy a place, but it seems to be gettin away.

    Got any tips?

    Rock on dude.

    Reply
  104. Biker, I present to you, published author, warrior poet, scholar and gentleman, your best work.
    I have gone through your posts and extracted your most lucid perceptions, finest linguistic finesse, sizzling comebacks, piercing rhetoric, and your deepest insights.

    Et Voila!

    :D
    ;)
    ;)
    :D
    :D
    ;)
    ;)
    :D
    ;)
    ;)
    ;)
    ;)
    :D
    ;)
    :D
    ;)
    :D
    ;)
    :D
    :D
    ;)
    ;)
    :D
    ;)
    :D :D :D
    :D
    :D
    ;)
    ;)
    :D
    ;)
    ;)
    :D
    ;)
    :D
    ;)
    :D
    ;)
    :D
    :D
    ;)
    :D
    ;)
    ;)
    :D
    :D
    :D
    ;)
    :D
    ;)
    ;)
    :)
    ;)
    :D
    ;)
    :)
    :D :D :D
    :D
    ;)
    ;)
    :D

    Reply
  105. Jason: “Im trying to save up for a deposit to buy a place, but it seems to be gettin away.”

    Thanks for your comments, Jason.
    Can only tell you what worked for me… .

    First, I realised I was initially in the wrong job, so I retrained.
    By retirement my _base_ salary was sixty times my beginning salary.
    Yes, I know that inflation was/is an issue there…

    Second, I was unable to buy what I wanted (initially), so I bought what I could afford. Very simple place… good quality, well-built home… but no garage or carport (I built one on, later) three tiny bedrooms, one main kitchen/living room. No dining room. It was thirteen times my starting salary, but I’d paid it out by thirty… and onsold.

    That approach was a buy-it-and-make-it-happen strategy. Inflation was my best friend. While wages and rents rose, repayments fell. I put anything spare into repayments, made fortnightly. Rode an old Yammie myself, at the time, an RD350.

    I don’t know if offset accounts existed then. I do know that initially I used redraw accounts, but my accountant pointed out some issues, including taxation problems.

    Eventually, I was able to buy what I wanted, where I _wanted_ to live.

    The simple strategies which have worked for me/us include:

    * Walking through whole ‘target’ suburbs, to see what’s out there.
    Good exercise. Used to take a pen and index cards. We now use
    a camera… .

    * We prefer to not use realtors… unless we have to (say vendor or buyer
    insists.) We use the same settlement agent and negotiate fees _hard_.

    * Offset accounts are brilliant. If I only had _one_ account, it would be
    an offset account. We’ve changed banks four times in 35 years. Talk to
    your bank. I overprepare for bank meetings, create a folder, etc.

    * FAs _haven’t_ really helped us. Two of the #@$%@R@$ could have cost us
    hundreds of thousands, perhaps more, had we followed their advice.
    Accountant has been amazing (but he’s a property bull, like me/us.)

    * The internet has helped a great deal. You need to ‘balance’ pro-property
    sites and blogs with sites like DRA, DRUS, etc, for a very worst-case-
    scenario. In the same way, we ‘balance’ Noel Whittaker’s advice
    against the Barefoot Investor, etc.

    This is getting a little long, so I’ll quit here, for now. Wrote a piece for PerthNow some time back, after they invited readers to do so. It was more along the lines of ‘how is it working for you now’?

    I’d do some of it differently, now. There were no FHOGs or Shared Equity Schemes, or Home Savers’ Accounts paying 25% after tax, back then!~ :D

    Reply
  106. Hey Biker, thanks man. I dunno what an offset account or an FA is, but will ask the bank.

    Im on 20 a year now, but finish me apprenticeship next year around chrissie, then I will be on 32.

    Im sharing a house with some gonzos, but its close to the beach, which is schweet. Lookin around for anything I might get a leg up on, cheapest is in Parra, or Ultimo. Long way from the breaks, but guess I could get a rack on the virago to carry the board (can you still do that? I dunno, ha ha).

    So I reckon I can get the government bonus, 7 grand, and mebbe borrow from westpac, coz they lend you 97% if you can prove you have been payin rent. Cheapest now is about 255G for 1 bedroom or a studio (whatever the *!@* that is!lol). So lemme work this out on the magic number machine, yeah about 7 and half grand. So I should be able to save another grand next year, but sure hope the price dont go up too much before then!

    But the calculators on the banks websites say that the repayment will be 400 a week, nearly me whole wage! -I should be pullin in about 540 a week when I finish me apprenticeship.

    I reckon I could live on 140 a week, 80 for food, 15 to feed the virago, 10 for lager, not sure about electricity n stuff, but there seems to be plenny of dole bludgers livin on not much more than that!

    Im a bit worried about all the things ya have to pay for in flats though. Me Auntie lives in a flat and she pays for all sorts of shizz, like the pool which she never uses (I do though! thanks Auntie :D). Do you know much about that shizz or where I could find out? If Im paying 400 to the bank and livin on the 140, Im worried about big expenses like that sneakin up on me, specially if i prang the beast.

    You rock dude, and dont let the stinkbuggers b8m you out.

    Reply
  107. Sounds like you’re on the right track, Jason.
    Get your apprenticeship finished and you’re laughing.

    Then, I guess, you might want to follow the money.
    I spent quite a few years doing that, mainly because at the time, I couldn’t afford capital city prices… and because higher pay (and tax benefits) made it worthwhile.

    As long as I’m not too far from the sea, I’m happy… :D

    Strata fees on flats can be an issue. Too low and you’ll get hit with major costs (including roofs!) later. Too high and it’s a drain on your budget. One of our young blokes wanted to buy eight apartments recently, until we walked him through the strata/repairs dramas. He’d have quickly become a slumlord in that particular scenario.

    FAs? Financial advisors. Talk to one, or two, maybe. Hear their views.
    Pay them _nothing_ is my advice. Generally they’ll steer you to products on which they reap fees and trailing commissions. If anything goes wrong with their dodgy recommendations, you’ll have no comeback whatsoever… .
    Easier to spot the shonks these days, with the new disclosure laws.

    Offset Account: Can be used as a simple transaction account, through which ALL transactions pass… and which reduces interest payments, meaning you’re paying a loan off much faster. We used to run ten until I pulled my Super and paid off our debts.

    In the list, I should have mentioned tax minimisation. Not talking here of tax avoidance, which is illegal. A good accountant can help you there.
    My missus regularly manages to find new info to minimise our taxation,
    on the internet. Our accountant is pretty impressed and has implemented several of her tips himself… .

    Good luck!~

    Reply
  108. Biler you CHUMP Jason is taking the P1SS !!!

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    June 22, 2011
    Reply
  109. Biker you da man!

    So a lot of the stuff you said went over my head, but Im always learning. Im thinkin that I cant really afford Sydney prices either, so I did some lookin on the central coast. Man, they cheap as chips up there! I dunno what people are goin on about, I reckon it might be getting even cheaper! Maybe when I finish me apprenticeship Ill get an even better deal. Schweet. Thanks man.

    Only problem is getting to work, I reckon about hour an a half if I fang it. I work a night shift. But yeah, maybe see if they need people to bake bread on the central coast.

    Thanks for the juice on strata fees, couldnt remember what were called. Not sure how I can tell if they are too high or too low. I called some of the ads I saw and asked. They all seem to high to me! Some more than others! :)

    I dont get how the offset account reduces my payments. Do I need to put money in it? Not sure if I will have any money left after paying the bank! Should I wait a few years an save some dosh before I buy? Sorry for all the questions dude …

    Dunno about tax minimisation, I dont pay much tax coz I dont get paid much :(

    Whaddaya reckon I should do to pay less? Dont know how much accountants cost, or how to tell a good one from a hole in the wall. Think Ill skip the FAs as well, sounds like they help sweet FA – ha ha.

    Your a legend dude.

    Reply
  110. HaHa… . My sweet FA just got home and corrected me on a couple of matters.

    Bank accounts: At your stage, a Home Savers’ account is the way-to-go.
    Even the Barefoot fella pushes him. I’ve seen claims of 32% (after tax) compounded over four years! Missus reminds me that an Offset Account isn’t the way to go unless you have a mortgage. Talk to the ANZ about both.

    Flats/Apartments: Never having owned any, we’re not really the people to ask. Think I’d buy a stand-alone. Within six months of purchase I’d sublet.
    I didn’t, but anything tolerable that helps build your equity is a plus.

    Accountants: We’ve had two good ones. Lucky there, maybe. Our current CPA is a bloke I’ve known for fifty years. Listen to what s/he has to say about property. Ask for a few tips. Not happy after a year? Try someone else… . Remember you claim your accountant’s fees on tax.

    Cheap as Chips: There are some bargains about. Cheaper for _you_ to buy an existing home than build, at the moment. (Better check that… . We pay no stamp duty on homes we build… other than on the land… but FHOs pay no stamp duty on either ‘buy’ or ‘build’ here in WA.)

    N Fool, I’ll treat any inquiry as genuine. It provides an opportunity to explain to _anyone_ reading this, how a couple of pretty ordinary people got ‘comfortable’, managed to travel abroad extensively, retire early… and achieve independence. Cheers, Jason!~ :D

    Reply
  111. Hey man, thanks for helpin a brudda out. Checked out the Home Savers account. Man what a deal. Government gunna give me a grand a year to buy a house. Dude! What a country!

    ANZ? Nah, think Ill pass, thanks anyway.

    Most of the other shizz goes over my head. Me baker.

    I still dont get how you changed jobs and were makin 60 times more money,for me that would be like being paid a million a year, way cool.
    I reckon Im in the wrong job too. I like baking bread, but there sure aint much bread in it! One day Ill have to retrain like you. Not like we need that much bread anyway.

    An NFoo, dont be a biscuit bra, you gunna blow out yer squeaker.

    Reply
  112. Check out the wages in N W WA, Jason. You can’t beat fresh bread…
    and our north is on the rise. Downside is the accommodation cost.

    Wages? Inflation helps you two ways. Your wages rise, your initial house cost remains constant. Every ten years you’re paying off 100c dollars with 60c dollars.

    You may end up getting a million plus a year. I left highschool, went north, made around $2K a year (actually $43 / week.) Went to uni and picked up my first degree… . I remember setting the (unbelievable) goal of $8K a year. If anyone had ever told me I’d be on $130K (base) at retirement, I’d have laughed. By retirement we had five income streams, more than trebling that base income.

    Buy now, or later? Depends. You probably need a larger deposit.
    I never doubted property would rise… and keep rising. But there have been flat periods, some lasting years. We’ve adjusted to the times…
    and we buy when very few are buying.

    Both our kids use the FHSAS. They figure that if they decide not to build or buy, they’ll roll the lot into Super. Not ANZ? Look at NAB, maybe. They’re really the only two ‘pro-property’ banks, in our experience.
    (And the other two will screw ya well above RBA rates when they can.)

    I guess the best advice I can give is ‘do your homework’. Some banks advertise liar rates. Disclosure laws now require them to tell you the Comparison (ie., real) Rate. Bankwest’s recent 6.9% turned out to be around 7.5%, for example. Effing liars everywhere!~ :D

    Reply
  113. Last question for you Biker. Serious one. No jokes, no sledging, no long epissles, just one question.

    Some (random) number of years ago, a friend of mine landed a really good job, with an unbelievable (for me) salary. I think his base was around 150 + super + bonus. The thing was, he never talked about his company much, and one day, he quit. Since he never talked about the company much while I was working there, I was curious about what they did, and why the h3ll he left, although looking back, it was obvious he wasn’t enjoying it much.
    He said that he couldn’t talk about the company while he was there because the company had him sign all sorts of non-disclosure agreements, and had hinted of all sorts of legal action and so on. What they did was basically a secret. And then he said that the company made no products, and provided no service to anyone. All they did was take advantage of a loophole in Australian law to “steal” money. Of course, technically, it wasn’t stealing, but what they were doing was illegal in the US and Europe, but the laws here hadn’t really caught up to it. While I can’t go into details, the company was making hundreds of millions of dollars off the loophole each year.

    Anyway, he couldn’t live with himself, so he quit and got a much lower paying job somewhere else. It was a severe disruption to his life and also his finances, but at least he seems much happier now, if poorer.

    On the one hand, it was perfectly legal what the company was doing. But on the other, they were just making (more like taking) money through a legal loophole and weren’t really a ‘business’ in the traditional sense of providing goods or services as trade.

    My question to you is: Did he do the right thing?

    (And no, it wasn’t me)

    Reply
  114. X: “Did he do the right thing?”
    X: “…he seems much happier now…”

    You’ve answered your own question, X.

    If you go back to the very, very first word of this thread,
    you’ll find a claim I wouldn’t ‘feel happy’ with above my name.

    It’s the very first lie of many which followed and the most easily refuted:
    ‘BankerS’.

    Reply
  115. Well, maybe there is some hope for you after all. Or not, you only addressed the issue of his personal happiness and not the bigger moral question about the company he worked for.

    He left because his ETHICS and MORALS clashed with the business model of the company, not because he was unhappy. Most people are unhappy in their job, they don’t give up 80 thousand a year for it.

    So please, if you will indulge me once more:
    Was his decision the correct one ETHICALLY/MORALLY?

    Reply
  116. X: “Was his decision the correct one ETHICALLY/MORALLY”?

    We respond to ethical considerations differently. A m-a-t-e of mine, for example, thinks it’s OK to lie… claims everyone does it. ;)

    My take on it? An example may help. We had budgeted for 9.5% interest.
    When rates fell to half that, did we drop rents? NOPE!~

    Instead, we put 80% window tinting on all sun-facing windows, put solar electricity systems on all north and west facing roofs, and fitted large inverter-type reverse-cycle air conditioners to all rentals which didn’t have them. NOTE: We have no tinting, air cond., or solar panel electricity on our property’s two homes. Do we want a medal for that? NOPE again.

    Was it the _ethical_ thing to do?

    It certainly made good business sense! Enhanced every property, enhanced tenant happiness… and… (best part here) it boosted our tax claims!~ :)

    Hope you don’t think I’ve dodged the question!~ ;)

    Reply
  117. >> We respond to ethical considerations differently.

    Yes.

    >> A m-a-t-e of mine, for example, thinks it’s OK to lie… claims everyone does it. ;)
    ->
    Biker: Our own two GenYs are a pretty good example… they have significant assets: property, cash, shares, bonds and Super
    Biker: They’re _both_ landlords! :D
    Biker: Both our kids use the FHSAS. They figure that if they decide not to build or buy, they’ll roll the lot into Super.

    ato.gov.au
    –>
    Eligibility to open an account

    To open a first home saver account, you need to meet all of the following conditions.

    You must:

    * be aged at least 18 and under 65 years old
    * have a tax file number you can quote in your application
    * _not have previously owned a home in Australia or Norfolk Island that has been your main residence_
    * not have previously opened a first home saver account.

    If you meet all these conditions, you satisfy the eligibility criteria and can open a first home saver account.
    > Hope you don’t think I’ve dodged the question!~ ;)

    No, I think you answered it. We all have our own moral compass. Sometimes we don’t know the whole story. Certainly for my friend’s sake, I couldn’t tell it.

    The company my friend worked for is still in business, still skimming 4c a day from every person in Australia. Maybe the law will change one day and they will have to shut up shop and start doing something productive. They weren’t even a drop in the bucket compared to the company I worked for. My friend’s company only took money from the present, the company I worked for took an order of magnitude more money from the future.

    I think their plan will come a cropper, but by then it will be too late. One thing I am thankful about the generation into which I was born is that I am too old to be drafted, and my kids are too young to serve.

    If the system is an ocean, I guess you have to spot a wave, paddle hard, and ride it to shore. Every now and then though, you have to weather a storm.

    Best of luck Biker.

    Reply
  118. Oh, and step by step instructions for sock(et) puppets I won’t give you. But here is a link, if you want to figure it out yourself:
    https://www.torproject.org/download/download.html.en

    Reply
  119. Wise answer. Better than I expected.

    You dodged the bullet. ;)

    The bit I don’t understand is the biz about our kids.
    Do you think I’m lying? If so, you _still_ fail to get it.
    I’ve no reason to lie or mislead. It’s a _total_ waste of time.
    Worse still, some AH like me will remind you of your lies every time you stick your head up.

    My kids? A common parental concern is that they won’t, for some reason, achieve what you (the _lucky_ generation! :D ) were able to achieve. Both our kids quickly exceeded our highest expectations. I actually empathise with Bill Bonner’s disclosures about his kids’ growing pains. I too felt what he’s feeling when my kids were around _ten._ From that point on, I realised I’d married into an incredibly _deep_ gene pool… and ceased worrying about it.

    Thumbs down? Is that a sock(et) in your pocket, or are you just happy to see me flying off to the NH for three months? :D

    Reply
  120. I didn’t thumb you down. In fact I haven’t voted on any comment in this thread.

    You claim your kids own property, and have first home saver accounts. Either your kids purchased property overseas, or they purchased property in Australia, but never lived in it. Otherwise, they would be ineligible for a first home saver account. Either way, they are now taking nearly 1000 dollars a year from the Commonwealth in direct subsidy, and up to 700 dollars a year as a tax concession.

    So, either you lied about them owning property, or lied about them having first home saver accounts
    OR
    they DO own property and other assets, and are receiving a Commonwealth subsidy of somewhere between 935 and 1700 dollars a year, on a technicality.

    If you insist that you never lie, then the only conclusion I can come to is that you are doing something that *I* consider to be unethical, immoral and in the long term, extremely harmful to the future of Australia.

    Before you object I want to stress that the above is MY OPINION. How many other Australians share that opinion is unknown to me, but I am willing to guess that it is very few.

    No, I am willing to bet that my opinion on the ethics/morality of this scheme is a minority opinion, and as such, I imagine that it will be taken advantage of by a great many people.

    Even if only 10% of GenY ALONE took advantage of this government handout, that would be around 500,000 people, at a cost of between 467 and 850 MILLION dollars. And that is just 10%! Furthermore, as government taxation averages out at 30% of gross over the population, that 467-850 million actually represents between 1.5 and 2.8 BILLION of economic activity, just to subsidize the real-estate industry, an industry that, in the main, produces nothing of value.

    95% of housing sales are churning the same house, over and over again. Nothing is built (you are probably in the 5%), no new product is created. Maybe a few taps and toilets made in the Peoples Republic of China get installed,and a bit of paint splashed about.

    The Princess Highway, THE main highway in NSW, is an absolute bl00dy disgrace. Hospitals are understaffed and at breaking point. Public Schools are crowded and underfunded, but Private Schools seem to be receiving 10 times the amount per student from Canberra, even while the parents minimize their taxes (not avoid, I googled it, thanks). I think perhaps people have forgotten what wealth actually is, or more likely, now that their kids are out of school, they don’t GIVE A SH!7 about what happens to mine.

    Still, I worked inside the machine that created this mess. It was, at it’s heart, an elaborate fraud. A shell game, with no pea. I saw the wizard of oz, pulling the levers, moving the horror from place to place so fast that no one could ever catch more than a glimpse of it as it flew past.

    But one day the wizard of oz will no longer be able to move the horror fast enough, and it will all come home to roost, in one massive tsunami of reverse-cycle stupidity (sorry to mangle my metaphors there). When that day will arrive, I really don’t know. It could be next month, or 10 years from now. I sure hope it’s next month, because in ten years, there will be nothing left to save.

    Whenever that day arrives, I sure hope you speak Chinese ;)

    Reply
  121. X: “…they purchased property in Australia, but never lived in it…”

    I’d have thought that the obvious solution, so why all the cr*p about lying? Why transfer _your_ unethical habits to others?

    I find your perceptions about the future in Australia fairly negative and pessimistic. You’ve identified some issues which you find unacceptable.
    Some of them I’ve helped improve in WA. No, I won’t elaborate.

    I’m optimistic about the present and the future. I’ve found optimism really works, if you’re prepared to act, rather than just yap. IF the nightmare you describe, “…the wizard of oz, pulling the levers, moving the horror from place to place so fast that no one could ever catch more than a glimpse of it as it flew past*…” is really the sick world in which you live, it helps explain your negativism. The imagery isn’t original, though. Fritz Lang beat you to it, over eighty years ago:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metropolis_(film)

    X: “Public Schools are crowded and underfunded, but Private Schools seem to be receiving 10 times the amount per student from Canberra, even while the parents minimize their taxes…” But you tell us you voted for the other team(?) Do you imagine a Liberal government would cut funding to private schools? Do you imagine I, or my children attended private schools?

    One of the reasons I’ve ignored so many of your comments is that you’re inconsistent, illogical… and frequently you’re just plain _wrong_.
    Your perception about successful Australians is so stereotypical and
    suffering from Tall Poppy Syndrome, that you dismiss the real hardships
    many of us faced to get where we are. And again, No, I won’t elaborate.

    X: “…one massive tsunami of reverse-cycle stupidity …it could be next month, or 10 years from now. I sure hope it’s next month…”

    Don’t hold your breath. Don’t expect a windfall from others’ misery.
    You’ll spend your life even unhappier than you are now.

    Reply
  122. >> IF the nightmare you describe, “…the wizard of oz, pulling the levers, moving the horror from place to place so fast that no one could ever catch more than a glimpse of it as it flew past*…” is really the sick world in which you live, it helps explain your negativism.

    Way to completely miss the point.

    >> One of the reasons I’ve ignored so many of your comments is that you’re inconsistent, illogical… and frequently you’re just plain _wrong_.

    Yes, I am just plain _wrong_, I admit it. You are 100% right. I’ve seen the light, thank you.

    >> Your perception about successful Australians is so stereotypical and suffering from Tall Poppy Syndrome, that you dismiss the real hardships many of us faced to get where we are.

    Yes, that’s what it is, Tall Poppy Syndrome. I really resent those people who went out, created businesses and products, built factories to manufacture those products, and employ Australians in same. THOSE Tall Poppies are everywhere, and I really resent the wealth and jobs they create.

    >> Don’t hold your breath. Don’t expect a windfall from others’ misery.

    Sigh.

    >> You’ll spend your life even unhappier than you are now.

    Thanks for the motivational pep talk. I feel much better now.

    Reply
  123. X: “Thanks for the motivational pep talk. I feel much better now.”

    HaHa… ! Having wished me dead… and sent thousands to dance on my grave,
    you’re probably despairing at my health, fitness and resilience. :)

    Sounds like this could be part of your problem:
    http://www.perthnow.com.au/lifestyle/technology/big-city-got-you-down-stress-study-may-explain-why/comments-fn5jm47w-1226080519209

    Reply
  124. >> HaHa… ! Having wished me dead… and sent thousands to dance on my grave, you’re probably despairing at my health, fitness and resilience. :)

    No, I really feel much better now. You’ve reminded my how dangerous it is to be emotionally invested in your financial assets.

    I would suggest you watch ‘The Ascent Of Money’ by Nial Ferguson (DVD) if I thought you would actually watch it.

    >> Sounds like this could be part of your problem:

    Nope. I’ve lived in Hong Kong, Tokyo and Los Angeles. This place is like a country town by comparison. Lots of little froggies looking around their little pond never thinking about the vast ocean. Jump higher little froggy, jump higher, and higher!

    Oh , and ..

    >> and sent thousands to dance on my grave,

    It was millions. But yeah, SFW.

    This has been an interesting experiment in memetics, but I think I will get back to writing my code for analyzing EEG signals and eye accessing cues.

    Take it easy dude. Don’t let the stinkbuggers b8m you out ;)

    Reply
  125. X: “‘The Ascent Of Money’ by Nial Ferguson”

    Must I watch it _again_?

    Suggest you watch ‘Inside Job’, again, to remind you of the _real cause_ of the GFC.

    X: “I think I will get back to writing my code for analyzing EEG signals and eye accessing cues.”

    Illustrates the enormous difference between us. You’re engaged in more sophistry on Friday night or Saturday morning… and I’m off to clean out some blocked drains, an hour’s drive from here… . :D

    Don’t let those EEG signals fr1 your amygdala.
    Some of your best reasoning happens there! ;)

    Reply
  126. >> Suggest you watch ‘Inside Job’, again, to remind you of the _real cause_ of the GFC.

    You think the GFC is over?

    >> and I’m off to clean out some blocked drains, an hour’s drive from here… . :D

    Wow, I always imagined that rich retired people would be sipping cocktails poolside in a tropical paradise while waiting for their lunch to be prepared by enthusiastic brown people working for 3c an hour.

    I guess getting rich in real estate really is hard work.

    >> Don’t let those EEG signals fr1 your amygdala.
    >> Some of your best reasoning happens there! ;)

    Actually no, the amygdala is primarily the center of emotional response, despite it’s proximity to the frontal cortex. (Sing with me, “Click Your Amygdala Forward and smile, smile, smile :) :) :D” )

    But thanks for your concern for my brain.

    Shouldn’t you be jetting off somewhere for 3 months?

    Reply
  127. X: “…the amygdala is primarily the center of emotional response…”

    Now read my comment again… . ;)

    X: ” You think the GFC is over?”

    I don’t think it touched us… .

    X: “I always imagined that rich retired people would be sipping cocktails poolside in a tropical paradise”

    I’d enjoy seeing a link in which I’ve ever described our circumstances as ‘rich’. We’re ‘comfortable’. I actually relish the maintenance work I do, after 43 years using my mindware. Hands-on problem-solving is enjoyable. I get paid travel… and many tradies in WA are multi-millionaires. They don’t need our custom. :D

    X: “Shouldn’t you be jetting off somewhere for 3 months?”

    It would be interesting to find myself on the same plane as Shoes,
    wouldn’t it? :D :D :D

    Reply
  128. >> I don’t think it touched us… .

    The word ‘us’ is ambiguous in that sentence.

    Reply
  129. X: “The word ‘US’ is ambiguous in that sentence.”

    X “…the center… just to subsidize… tax minimization… realized…etc… etc…”

    It certainly seems to be… . ;)

    Biker Pete
    June 25, 2011
    Reply
  130. >> Don’t let those EEG signals fr1 your amygdala.
    >> Some of your best reasoning happens there! ;)

    This speaks volumes. Nothing like appealing to the mammalian emotions to convince people something is ‘reasonable’. It sure beats science or logic anyway!

    Given your deep emotional attachment to your investment strategy and your financial assets, it doesn’t surprise me that your amygdala is the basis for your ‘reasoning’

    The word ‘us’ is ambiguous in that sentence.
    >> X: “The word ‘US’ is ambiguous in that sentence.”

    Given that you could have easily copied and pasted, I wonder what you are trying to imply by capitalizing the ‘us’.

    >> X “…the center… just to subsidize… tax minimization…
    >> realized…etc… etc…”

    >> It certainly seems to be… . ;)

    Riiiight … your ‘us’ is immune. Of course.

    I assume you are claiming the majority position with your ‘us’?

    Reply
  131. X: “…it doesn’t surprise me that your amygdala is the basis for your ‘reasoning'”

    No, your brain-stem ‘fight/flight’ responses, your need to ‘kill’ your enemy and celebrate with ritual afterwards, are primitive and pre-cognitive behaviours. Your need to continually lie and camouflage these base actions with ‘sophistry’ aren’t highly-evolved behaviours.
    These remain characteristics of extreme, unhealthy rage.
    They damage _you_.

    My ‘US’ isn’t immune; it’s a reference to your US spelling throughout your posts. It’s curious, given some of your claims… .

    But enlighten us: Are you _going_ (to leave this god-awful country) or _staying_ (to triumphantly wade through the gore, fistfuls of dollars-in-paws) to buy* our unencumbered properties? :D

    * And with _what_?! ;)

    Reply
  132. Are you claiming your position is the majority position or not?

    >> I don’t think it touched us… .

    Who is the ‘us’ you are referring to? All Australians? Western Australians? Yourself and your peer group? Your extended or immediate family? You and your spouse? The Royal ‘we’? Some other group of people?

    The rest of your position is clear to me:
    * your investments
    * your ethics
    * your absolute certainties about the future

    The only thing that remains unclear is whether or not you believe that the majority of Australians share your position. Or, conversely, that my position is a minority position.

    Well?

    Reply
  133. X: “The only thing that remains unclear…”

    Well, that’s not true. You told us you’re leaving this terrible place for a far better one. Later, you advised you’re sticking around for the Big Bang, to personally benefit from “the carnage”… . So, which is it, ‘X’?
    Going? Staying? And what will you u$e to snap up all these bargains?!~ :D

    “We”? Australia was relatively unscathed. Western Australia is unaffected.
    Some political priorities like proposed mining taxes have dented consumer confidence. Personally? No difference. Really smart fellas like you look down at our 20+yo cars… and grin… .
    (So do we… . ;) )

    Going? Staying? Flight or fight? Get that amygdala into gear, son. That’s where you make those instant, lifesaving decisions… and, it _appears_, where much of your long-term planning occurs, too… . :D

    Biker Pete
    June 26, 2011
    Reply
  134. >> You told us you’re leaving this terrible place for a far better one. Later, you advised you’re sticking around for the Big Bang, to personally benefit from “the carnage”… . So, which is it, ‘X’?

    Asked and answered. You appear to have missed it. It’s both.

    >> Really smart fellas like you look down at our 20+yo cars… and grin… .

    I’m guessing you’re a Magna man, probably the six.

    >> Going? Staying? Flight or fight? Get that amygdala into gear, son. That’s where you make those instant, lifesaving decisions…

    Nope, that is the Triune brain. The amygdala’s role in decision making is the emotional response to each of the options. The fight or flight response is immediate and instinctive. Like, when the bombs start falling in Kabul, pack your stuff in the car and drive to Pakistan.

    Now, if you were talking about the consideration of being a long way from my family in my deliberations, then yes, that would be the role of amygdala, to weigh fraternity against opportunity.

    >> and, it _appears_, where much of your long-term planning occurs, too.

    Yes, being politically and economically disenfranchised did play a role in my decision, but only to the extent that it affects my potential NETT income, not the way I feel about it.

    To this end I am taking action, just like I have 4 times previously. I’m not sure why you find that so difficult to understand. Maybe you are just being belligerent.

    >> “We”? Australia was relatively unscathed. Western Australia is unaffected.

    Nothing works as a sell signal quite like a certainty held by the majority.

    Reply
  135. Belligerent? Moi? :D

    Did I offer to _kill_ you… and dispatch millions of minions to dance on your grave?! :D

    X: “It’s both…” ? Let me guess. Let’s see. You leave… within the month you referred to? Then you re-emigrate when things go all-Armageddon-like… and you clean up, right? Or perhaps you stay…. then when things go pear-shaped, you swoop down and feast on-the-kill. THEN you leave(?)

    These are both _good plans._ You need do little but wait.
    Nothing works quite as well as doing nothing*, does it?

    * Perhaps that’s unfair. There’s always your good daily whinge, a few lies, a hot cup of blame, with a little dose of anger and hatred mixed in to sustain you! And, of course, staying on lookout for the cargo planes. ;)

    Reply
  136. You must really be lonely.

    Reply
  137. X: “You must really be lonely.”

    You really must be _sick_.

    Get help. Why live in such misery? It isn’t life at all, this waiting for a catastrophic event which will transform your life and make you a winner.

    Would you like me to post your Top Ten extraordinary statements?
    Perhaps you need to reflect on your very confused position…
    (re)consider just how _you’re_ perceived, ‘X’.

    You’re supposed to be the unknown quantity, X; but I think you represent a lot of unhealthy human weaknesses: envy, anger, sloth, revenge, hatred…
    to name a few. Should I choose to list these amazing ten comments, you may see yourself reflected, as not only unwell… and very confused… but as highly contradictory.

    It’s probably enough to simply call you the name you yourself answer to:

    Liar.

    Biker Pete
    June 27, 2011
    Reply
  138. BTW X, I don’t nomally post on this site. Not Fooled is an idiot who was caught red handed lying about owning a large amount of expensive property in WA. If you head over to the Perth Now website , you will see an old fashion tar and feathering of this clown on the site. Links no problem. Motives ??

    Reply
  139. Yes, he’s certainly taking a hiding, Dogman. “Old fashioned tar and feathering…” probably sums up his situation well:

    http://www.perthnow.com.au/business/local-property-players-build-portfoilios/story-e6frg2ru-1226080466625

    It seems liars never learn… .

    Reply
  140. Tar & feathering ? really ?

    2 chumps blowing each other. Keep it about me ladies I just get a free run at talking about why property is not worth buying in todays market.

    Tee Hee Hee (FYI I am winning & you two clowns know it)

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    June 29, 2011
    Reply
  141. “Tee hee hee” says it all. Yes, it’s been a while since you bleated:

    “Go away and don’t reply to anything I post from here on in and I promise to leave you alone as well.” October 14, 2009….

    and…

    “Hey Travs forget about me it is not about me …. why make me the centre of your focus …” December 04, 2010.

    You’re winning? Why this need to reassure yourself? Do I ever need to state: “I am winning” (?) There’s a reason for this. You’re a weiner,
    a DH, not a winner. ;)

    Reply
  142. You are winning… ha ha”
    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype Posted at 3:19 PM March 13, 2010 said “…Woodvale was owned then used equity in house to get a company housing loan to buy the 4 Karratha units. “”. You could not prove this lie, you just changed threads after a weak attempt to throw out a pathetic red herring comment.. The way pretended you structured this loan does not exist. Your company that is not a bank cannot take a mortgage which is a company housing loan..That makes you a liar, that means you don’t own the property you said you did. Does being proven you are a liar on a property blog that you do not own the property you said you did make you a winner. ??? Only a bi polar drop kick would imagine that. You are constantly proved a liar over on Perth Now , and you only defense is a weak child like attempt to deflect the conversation away from the facts about you. lets pop some links on your blog site shall we. Readers need all the facts. Oh a sample of other readers
    “J HIGGINS of wa Posted at 4:05 PM Today..

    @ Not Fooled By property Spruikers Hype… no one believes you (who has half a brain). your comments are directed at the uneductaed market! i have just got 7 of my colleagues to read your posts (we are consulting engineers). this is the response to the mini poll: 7/7 thought you were full of it; 4 said you were a disgruntled agent trying to get back at an industry that ruined your life; 6 said u were a a stockbroker. amongst us educated folk, YOU HAVE ZERO CREDIBILITY. CIAO.

    Reply
  143. Hey Trav’s RP Data just said ” Perth was by far the worst performer, with prices down 4.2 per cent over the May quarter, and 7.5 per cent over the past year.” would you like a link with that? Of course you would: http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2011/06/30/3257433.htm?section=justin

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    June 30, 2011
    Reply
  144. Gawd… Two losers-in-a-row!~ Meanwhile, Dogman’s off to Europe… and I’m off to North America… and N Fool is off-his-head!~ (And me old mate Shoes is still waiting for his end-of-year Report Card!~ Patience, my son! :D )

    See ya in Melbourne, Shoes. I’ll know you _instantly_ .
    You just watch out for Bad Santa!~ ;)

    Reply
  145. Well who’d of thunk’d that the banks would be in trouble this year.. Who’d of thunk’d that they would struggle to keep the profit margins.. Who’d of thunk’d they would suffer loss of earnings and be subjected to downgrades..

    March next year will be interesting for the December Quarter banking situation.. Will be interesting indeed…

    Stillgotshoeson
    July 2, 2011
    Reply
  146. Howdy and thanks to all contributors. I just stumbled on this commentary and haven’t had so much fun for ages.

    X – I am one of those late BBs but there is some real food for thought in what you say. Nice prose. You should consider journalism.

    Biker Pete – you are a nasty shit. You bought property because you were either too stupid or lazy to do anything else with your savings and because you happened to join the RE band wagon and have made some huge paper profits you feel smug and superior about it. Get a life.

    Reply
  147. Johno, you sound like one of those BBs who p*ssed it up against the wall for forty years. Get an Old Age Pension. :D

    Reply
  148. @Johno.. You are mistaken about poor old Biker Pete.. He is the sage and Savior of the property bulls.. His achievment of wealth and prosperity is on this (and many others) forum for all to see. His pearls of wisdom are here for all to embrace and use to enhance their financial security because what worked for him over the last 30 odd years will without doubt work for others, the mantra “Past performance is no indicator of future success.” does not apply to Australian Property as Australia is immune to the worlds woes and it is different here.

    “Us” Bears should be ignored, we are just trying to talk down the property market to see others financially hurt, to profit from their losses, to see them hanging from ropes in their garages or gas themselves in their cars, us evil bears should not be listened too… I mean property prices only ever go up… oops property prices may stagnate a bit but not fall.. oops property prices may decline (not fall) a little in some areas but that is ok because, see it is like this, there are property marketS..

    I mean look at the share market, it fell 54% and is still 33% short of the high.. (we will ignore that the share market is made up of thousands of companies and many have increased significantly)

    Just have to look at Steve Keen, I mean how wrong was he.. so wrong he took a long walk up a mountain..again we will ignore the other bits of the bet because they don’t suit our argument.. Yes Steve was wrong* with his first part of the bet but the second part is currently in motion.
    *Government intervention post bet/comment paid a hand in this happening, as has been proven by other countries attempts, government intervention may delay but can not prevent events that must and will occur.

    The 6 year old in him is busy clicking screenshot after screenshot waiting for the “yeah I was wrong but he was wrong too” defense..

    The events “us” bears have been mentioning are now occurring in full view.. even mainstream press is finally printing the bad news.. Will the fall be more gradual like in the USA or will it gain momentum exponentially? Who knows.
    What we do know is property prices falling.
    Banks are struggling to continue growth… Current “pricing” war will redistribute the mortgage pie, however there is only so much pie available, 1 bank gets more pie means less pie for the others.
    Consumers are keeping wallets and purses shut as retail figures show.
    More small businesses are closing because of above or finance problems.
    People are saving or paying down debt growth in credit is virtually nil the previous 2 decades of growth has been based on credit, with out there can (and is) only decline.
    Life is a roller coaster ride with its ups and downs, at the moment we are on a down part

    Stillgotshoeson
    July 3, 2011
    Reply
  149. Well, here’s a new variation on Shoes’ evil curses! :D :

    “…to see them hanging from ropes in their garages or gas themselves in their car…”

    Quite interesting additions to his past twisted effort:

    “1.) Slow painful death through Liver Cancer; 2.) Prostate Cancer, pissing blood; 3.) Broken neck through motorcycle accident; 4.) Total incapacitation, spoon-fed and arse-wiped by missus.”

    Gawd, no wonder he’s a _visitor_ to his past family home! How they must rejoice when he enters that happy domicile. ;)

    Reply
  150. BTW, mate, while you’ve been hangin’ on the legs of the dear departed… and deeply inhaling the carbon monoxide as it leaks from the vehicles of the permanently garaged, Mrs Biker and I have been knocking out two dozen large jars of our ginger marmalade. Everything but the sugar grown on our own place… and all cooked up on a hot Rayburn with jarrah from our hill.

    Life’s too short for cursing those who figured out their priorities early in life, son. Good luck with your much vaunted get-rich-quick schemes, Shoes.
    My guess? All those chickens-you-counted flew off, golden eggs intact. ;)

    Reply
  151. Hey Biker Pete (Or Should I call you Pinhead?)

    Want to have some fun at your net Auction or Home Open?

    Follow the link & Print this BINGO Card.

    http://nfbpsh.blogspot.com/

    I Guarantee You will shout BINGO every time.

    In Fact it should take no more than 5 minutes to play this game.
    (Realtors wont be able to help themselves)

    This Bingo Card is full of Realtors Catch phrases & Spruiks.

    Perhaps you might like to try an alternative method, that is much much more fun.

    Print this Card out and hand it to the Realtor. Now inform him that he cannot use any of the phrases on the card when talking about the property you are about to view.

    Watch as he stands there in stunned silence unable to speak.

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    July 6, 2011
    Reply
  152. Hey biker Pete,

    You will no doubt be pleased to know that my Australian Realtors BS Bingo page on my blog site so far has had 23484 hits today.

    Classic people always remember & retain a comedy message.

    FYI I can track where the hits come from 1800 were from Bubblepedia where the Bingo story was featured & 237 from the DRA site.

    I knew you would be pleased for my thanks for your support keep doing what you do I could not do it without you.

    “You are the wind beneath my wings”

    Tee Hee Hee

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    July 6, 2011
    Reply
  153. Ooops that should be 2348 & not 23,484 don’t want to make up numbers that were not true!!

    People would then call me Biker

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    July 6, 2011
    Reply
  154. I’m in Vancouver BC, wiener. :D

    Wind is certainly your issue, son. ;)

    Reply
  155. Pinhead. Your “Google World Tour has started”

    If in Vancouver check out this site: http://www.greaterfool.ca/

    And you thought we had a Bubble. Ideal place for a simpleton like you to invest in. Hope you have your Cheque Book.

    Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype
    July 14, 2011
    Reply
  156. Yes, we’re away for three months, Mr Homeswest. We’re staying with friends at the moment. The Vancouver suburb we’re in is doing well:

    http://search.suttonwestcoast.com/BC/Vancouver/Shaughnessy/real-estate-market

    Not a buying trip. We think WA is the world’s best value… . :D

    Reply
  157. Very good info. Lucky me I came across your site by accident (stumbleupon).

    I’ve saved as a favorite for later!

    Reply
  158. Everyone loves what you guys are usually up too. This type of clever work
    and reporting! Keep up the good works guys I’ve added you guys to blogroll.

    Reply

Leave a Reply

Letters will be edited for clarity, punctuation, spelling and length. Abusive or off-topic comments will not be posted. We will not post all comments.
If you would prefer to email the editor, you can do so by sending an email to letters@dailyreckoning.com.au