Well, so much for the supposed confidence-building announcements from the EU over the weekend. European equity markets fell heavily when trading resumed on Monday. Bond yields in Portugal, Spain, Belgium and even Italy continued to rise to new highs.
The bureaucrats in the EU are losing their already tenuous grip on the situation. Despite assurances that senior bondholders will not take 'haircuts' on their investments (not on lending before 2013 anyway) markets are imposing their own form of ruthless discipline.
For years the concept of risk was ignored. For years countries like Greece, Ireland and Portugal could borrow on terms almost identical to Germany, despite massive differences in economic structures.
Now, at a time when EU officials are desperately trying to convince markets that risk still doesn't matter - that you can still have reward without risk - the markets are not buying it.
This puts mounting pressure on the European Central Bank (ECB) to 'do something'. It meets on Thursday European time to discuss monetary policy. Bond investors will be sweating on the bank to open the liquidity floodgates and buy up peripheral European debt big time.
Whether it will do this is questionable. But even if it does, such action would only push the problem a few months down the track. We're dealing with a problem of solvency here, not a liquidity problem. Such problems cannot be dealt with by temporarily monetising debt.
We wonder how Ben Bernanke is feeling about all this. On the one hand, he's probably relived that some other central banker is the centre of attention for a change. On the other, he's probably gutted that his QEII plans seem to have backfired.
Check out the chart of the US dollar index below
The dollar has rallied strongly since Bernanke announced his money printing scheme in early November. Things haven't exactly gone according to plan for Ben. He's trying to lower the value of the dollar to generate inflation and boost export competitiveness.
But he's forgetting the minor point about the US dollar being the world's reserve currency. In times of economic stability, the US dollar will generally trade according to domestic fundamentals. In times of turmoil though, it retains its safe haven status.
Because the euro is under all sorts of pressure, capital is now flowing back to the US dollar. It's all relative in the world of currencies and as bad as the US dollar looks, it's not as bad as all the other major currencies.
If there's one lesson to be learned from the euro crisis it's that problems begin at the core. The US dollar is at the epicentre of the global economy. The peripheral currencies (euro, yen) will likely come under major pressure before the greenback faces its day of reckoning.
But one thing is for sure, the dollar is not as good as gold. Gold is in a consolidation phase at the moment and just doesn't seem to want to put in a decent correction. Dips are bought with gusto. It's a sign of a powerful bull market when everyone seems to be waiting for a correction and it doesn't happen.
The bull market in gold is the mirror image of the bear market in government policymaking and fiat currencies. The trend has a long way to run yet.
Closer to home, RBA governor Glenn Stevens was out last night talking about the terms of trade again. Unusually for a central banker, this was a thoughtful speech about how Australia should think about managing the recent jump in the terms of trade.
As you can see from the graph Stevens presented in his speech, the recent spike in the terms of trade is up there with past historical increases. The question he raises is whether it's a permanent or temporary shift in our fortunes.
The terms of trade, by the way, measures the value of our exports in terms of imports. As Stevens puts it, 'when the terms of trade are high, the international purchasing power of our exports is high.'
Stevens correctly points out that history suggests the huge increase in the terms of trade will be temporary. He just doesn't know when the temporary bit will kick in.
If it is, he says that 'it would probably not make sense for there to be a big increase in investment in resource extraction if that investment could be profitable only at temporarily very high prices'In other words, Australia's resource sector could 'probably'suffer from overinvestment if it turns out that China's insatiable appetite for iron ore and coal is more a product of its massive credit boom than anything else.
Has Glenn Stevens been reading a bit of Ludwig von Mises lately?
Of course you don't have to have studied Austrian economics to come to that conclusion, you just need common sense. Surprisingly for a central banker, Stevens seems to have plenty of it.
But let's not get too excited. There is always 'the other hand'.
'On the other hand, experienced people seem to be saying that something very important - unprecedented even - is occurring in the emergence of very large countries like China and India. If the steel intensity of China's GDP stays where it is already, and China's growth rate remains at 7 or 8 per cent for some years to come, which appears to be the intention of Chinese policy-makers, then the demand for iron ore and metallurgical coal will rise a long way over the next couple of decades.'
Translation: 'This time is different.'
Lookout.
P.S. to get The Daily Reckoning direct to your inbox sign up to our free e-mail newsletter or if you prefer to use RSS, subscribe to the Daily Reckoning RSS feed.
Related Articles:
- Everyone is Busily Debasing Their Currency
- Citizens Easily Coerced into Using Government Currency
- We are Confident the Bull Market in Gold is Not Over
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- Time to Buy Gold Stocks…Again
About the Author
Greg Canavan is the editor of Sound Money, Sound Investments, a financial report devoted to unearthing great value investments amid today's "money illusion" of fiat currency. For a free trial of Greg's service, go to Sound Money, Sound Investments.
Comment by Ross on 30 November 2010:
That last spike was the Korean War wool boom but the irony escaped Greg. They called it the meatgrinder. Rudd doesn't appear flushed at all and somehow thinks he has the wherewithall to stand for the nation when he falls in behind the crazy confrontationalist Lee. But Rudd's really batting for the wrong team altogether, hasn't anyone noticed how he has that Dear Leader look and demeanor about him?
Comment by Lachlan on 30 November 2010:
I like what I hear from Glenn Stevens lately. Noted in his speech that household savings in Aust are up from 1% to 9 or 10% in last five years or so. Encouraging. Glenn encourages savings over consumption for govs and individuals going forward. Wont hold breath waiting for govs to take the advice but well done Glenn anyhow. Maybe he has been taken back by all the economic carnage overseas.
Comment by Stillgotshoeson on 30 November 2010:
Gerry Harvey of Harvey Norman Stores was in the paper last week complaining how retailers are doing it tough now and that it is a hard environment to be making money, he and other retailers ar not making money on flat scren TV's as they are discounted out of margins. Harvey Norman just had a 60 months interest free promotion on Audio/Visual stuff to try and boost sales.. this if anything probably brought forward purchases to make November look good but a lul will probably ensue with post Christmas Sales taking a hiding.
Gerry was also calling for the government to introduce GST on online purchases of overseas goods as this was effecting retailers here.
Rate rises and increases in utility costs are certainly starting to bite into household incomes
We may be close to tipping point on rate rises. I assumed (wrongly it may seem) that households had a little more spare capacity in household finances.
I think saving has become mandatory, not optional.
Comment by Lachlan on 30 November 2010:
I bought a computer at Harvey Normans this time last year Shoes and I asked the clerk how business was. He said it was fairish, but added they (HN) were predicting the GFC to be all over very soon now that the global recovery was underway. I didnt bother saying anything.
My markets are much softer now than at the outset of the GFC.
I am optimistic though... even more so than then. If markets tank again I wont be panicked. Certain trends are establishing themselves as I see it. I could be wrong but we all have to choose our path.
Comment by Stillgotshoeson on 30 November 2010:
Back in March or so Gerry Harvey was in the news saying the GFC is over and it will be a bumper year for Harvey Norman Stores...
Comment by Stillgotshoeson on 30 November 2010:
Work is very quiet for me. Many days I don't go in as there is nothing to do.
We have 2 forward orders for February and March next year and that's it.
Gladstone fell through so that is not a goer.
Numbers may be cut next year. Kind of hoping I am one of them. Have dropped hints that I would take a vountary redundancy.
Back has recovered well after the operation early in the year.. maybe get the knee done now while the company still pays my income protection
Comment by Lachlan on 30 November 2010:
Well, lets face it Shoes. Conspicuous consumption suits Gerrys wallet. Thankfully Aussies are doing the right thing and taking some responsibility for their own financial well being...a reversal of the recent trend maybe. Gerry and his staff can look out for themselves and hopefully the gov will allow them to. Catch ya round Shoes.
Comment by Biker on 30 November 2010:
Have been watching the price of large Sony screens for two years now.
Hardly Normal is BS-ing. His costs have dropped, but prices are virtually the same.
The story line? I'm _giving_ them away... . A little like REIWA's line:
"Houses have never been so cheap!~"
Comment by Don on 1 December 2010:
I don't know about you guys but I feel that quality-wise flat screen tvs are a bit of a step backwards compared to the old CRT. Sure, running it on high definition using blu-ray you can get some amazing pictures but on the run of the mill tv channels it is a bit of a meh. As far as the size goes it is like going to the movies. After a few minutes the screen shrinks down to normal size and you hardly notice it - maybe I am just old fashioned but I haven't seen any reason to justify splashing out a thousand bucks or so just yet. Much better things to spend my money on.
Comment by Ross on 1 December 2010:
Don, the LED's with the equalising brightness according to room light have boosted them over the old ones. The big backed old digitals had more MHz until just recent flast screens too.
As for Harvery Norman. I keep quoting Trevor Sykes. After the Korean War wool boom there was a period of half a decade where the pretence and commodity prices held up but then in 1960 it hit the fan. The part of the economy that went bust first was consumer credit in the appliance retail industry and their associated internal finance arms. They were the biggest financial busts in that deep recession and they had the worst recovery rates at liquidation. Happened again in the 70's too. I wouldn't hazard a guess that buying CDS on whoever Gerry is giving interest free terms to is going to get far more expensive than Spanish bonds.
Comment by Don on 1 December 2010:
I have no doubt that the quality will improve Ross, just at the moment I have not seen anything that is going to make me jump. That is the nature of new tech - the longer you wait, the better and cheaper it gets - except for microsoft operating systems of course.
Comment by Ross on 1 December 2010:
Big box prices are a funny thing Don. They dipped on lack of demand, came back up a bit on higher overseas costs, and then have dipped a bit again recently but nowhere near as much as the AUD's rise. The story with the dollar might determine your best timing as there is a lag period between an AUD fall and retail price reaction. The less demand in that period the longer the price rise reaction period.
Being a one time German arbeiter yet a proponent of small government I reckon this one is right on the money
http://www.prudentbear.com/index.php/thebearslairview?art_id=10473
Comment by Stillgotshoeson on 1 December 2010:
I think even if the price of the Sony flat screens have stayed about the same, the features and quality of picture would have improved.
Panasonic are good units and they have come down heaps.. Ex and her boyfriend bought a Panasonic 50" Full High Definition back in Feb or March for just shy of $2000. The updated version of the same TV is $1300 to $1500 depending on whomever has them on sale.. Good Guys, Harvey, Retrovision.
I still use the 68cm CRT's Kids have one for the X-Box, I have mine in the lounge.
Set top box on the kids one so they get all the channels. PVR with a 250GB Hard Drive for the one in the lounge to record digital TV.
When they die, I will replace them, however do not see the need to rush out and buy on "just because"
As Ross has highlighted, the dollar play may make a difference, if it dives that could cause them to rise a little (reduce sales more maybe?) so may make sense to buy one then..
GE Money and AGC are the backers od HN Interest Free Promotions.
GE almost went under in 2008.
Comment by gutfeeling on 1 December 2010:
Stillgotshoeson, re. "I assumed (wrongly it may seem) that households had a little more spare capacity in household finances."
- that always seems to be the view of the RBA and Government, but I think so many people have borrowed to the hilt there is just nothing more left. There seem to be plenty of people who are earning good money, and those in government are still getting their CPI increases (or more - 10% at the NSW RTA this year for two people I know) but there are plenty whose wages haven't moved very far at all in 10 years as well, whereas the basic costs of electricity, water and food have gone up.
Comment by Biker on 1 December 2010:
"I have no doubt that the quality will improve Ross, just at the moment I have not seen anything that is going to make me jump."
Same here, Don. In fact my 68cm Panasonic Model TC29V25A sounds identical to Shoes'. Probably the best TV on the market back in '94.
I've tracked every (new and existing) model Sony for two years. There have been periods when prices fell a little. This isn't one of them. Perhaps Ross is spot-on when he states that: "...there is a lag period between an AUD fall and retail price reaction. The less demand in that period the longer the price rise reaction period." Perhaps the market is saturated...
Not particularly concerned. A 46" is the largest our living room can handle without dominating the scene (much of the room is glass)... but I'll be interested to see if there is any reduction, ever, as a result of our rising dollar. Until then, Hardly's tears are those of large reptiles.
Comment by Stillgotshoeson on 1 December 2010:
Comment by gutfeeling on 1 December 2010:
Stillgotshoeson, re. "I assumed (wrongly it may seem) that households had a little more spare capacity in household finances."
- that always seems to be the view of the RBA and Government, but I think so many people have borrowed to the hilt there is just nothing more left. There seem to be plenty of people who are earning good money, and those in government are still getting their CPI increases (or more - 10% at the NSW RTA this year for two people I know) but there are plenty whose wages haven't moved very far at all in 10 years as well, whereas the basic costs of electricity, water and food have gone up.
I knew things were tight and would get worse but I thought closer to mortgage rates of 10% before any real hard felt effects would flow through.. this seems to not be the case. Mortgages are in the 7 percentile range.. Maybe 9 is going to be the limit. Banks still have the problem of high funding that WHEN the RBA (and they will) lower rates the banks may not. Interesting 12 months ahead for the Australian economy
Comment by Biker on 1 December 2010:
There may also be a point at which property investors and FHBs alike simply stop borrowing. Perhaps WestPac has already anticipated that, moving towards business loans rather than those for housing.
"Interesting 12 months ahead for the Australian economy" (?)
If true, WestPac may be hit first, as businesses fold. Traditionally business loans have been higher risk. Kelly is betting against this... .
Interesting 12 months? Personally, I suspect 2011 may be a stellar year for us. Won't have all that long to wait, will we?
Comment by Biker on 1 December 2010:
Some more on this:
http://www.watoday.com.au/business/whos-right-the-rba-or-abs-20101201-18g4r.html
Comment by Ned S on 1 December 2010:
Either my dungers are worth more than I reckon, or there are some rather misinformed sellers in parts of SE QLD.
Some readers might recall me mentioning that my parents moved about a year ago. Typical enough low set brick 4 Bed, 2 Bath, 2 Car type joint a bit over 20 km from the CBD as the crow flies. Paid high $300Ks. Similar joint in the same little street is now on the market - For a $79K higher ask than what my parents paid. Fully expect it would be a bit nicer inside - Allow $20K for no internal repaint or new carpets plus a bit of whatever else required.
That's still about 15% higher as an ask on what my parents might have considered paying them 12 months ago. When I reckon a vendor of that type of place in that type of location, shouldn't be too surprised if they find even pretty serious buyers are expecting a discount of anywhere up to about 10% on what Mr Kudd's cashed up FHBs were paying a year ago.
Comment by Stillgotshoeson on 1 December 2010:
Just got back from catching up with a friend.. 2 houses near him up for Auction last Saturday.. Both passed in and are on market with for sale signs out front. He has a couple of dogs that he takes for a walk daily, reckons there are a dozen houses up for sale that have been up for sale for around 2 weeks or more.. Not normal for the area he is in he reckons houses normally sell in days.. He is thinking I might be right (finally
) about a turn in the housing market.
He is around 30K's out of Melbourne, Strong Middle Class Liberal voting seat.
Comment by Biker on 2 December 2010:
Lots of anecdotal references, particularly in WA... but how does one explain ABS data showing a 9.4% rise in Perth homes in the last twelve months? All the blogs I read are talking our market down... oversupply... Xty thousand homes on the market... longer waiting periods for sales... etc, etc... yet Perth house prices _rose_ 9.4%, October - October.
No-one would doubt that there are more homes on the market, or that selling times are longer, or that auction clearances are down (in your eastern cities, anyway). Despite this, very few WA families would have picked up 9.4% after tax, on their investments October 2009 - October 2010. In other words, homes rose at least twice as fast as interest on savings.
"I might be right (finally
) about a turn in the housing market."
You well may be. One indicator would be that the fella to whom you recently made an offer will drive up in panic, waving a contract, yelling "Please buy our house!" Maybe the family will utterly blow their credit cards over Christmas. If not, the banks may raise rates in December, despite RBA recommendations. Good luck, Euan!~
Comment by Biker on 2 December 2010:
Similar situation in one of our streets, Ned. We paid $323K for a 4X2X2 which is returning good rent. We imagined its value now at around $360K.
Far less impressive house in the same street has just been listed at $385K.
Doesn't mean they'll get it, but these are still 'cheapies' in that beach area. There's nothing around those prices for sale, so if it sells, we may list ours at $405K.
Comment by Ned S on 2 December 2010:
I wouldn't be at all surprised if WA behaves differently to Brissie mate. Though over here, I'm definitely sniffing a buying opportunity coming along over the next year or so. But as I keep saying, I'm working in cash. (As are you effectively. And Shoes with the plan he's discussed - I think?)
For those working on leverage, their game is different. Plus there are quite different versions of the leveraged game anyway!
We've all just got to play our own games according to our own circumstances. To our own best perceived advantages. And in my case, not being very bright or insightful most of the time, plus a bit aged and adverse to risk, my personal strategy simply has to involve some hedging. Unless I get an epiphany and have the cash on hand to back it up should it turn out to be hopelessly wrong!!!
Comment by Ned S on 2 December 2010:
A somewhat older chap once said to me that you need 6 houses to support yourself in retirement. One to live in; And 5 to rent out. In a somewhat sane world I reckon he's about on the money - 30% of a household income would be required to buy; Those who can only afford to pay 20% of their household income on accommodation would quite sensibly continue to choose to keep renting. And 5 times 20% of such potential entry level buyers' household income makes up the basic livable income. For a household that owns it's own home outright. So has no mortgage repayments to make and can thus afford to keep putting the equivalent of the mortgage payments on a house back into upkeep and other expenses of the 5 properties that provide their income.
Ni nites from Ned again - When he starts talking such nonsense, it's obviously become time to put him bye byes!
Comment by Biker on 2 December 2010:
No, you make good sense... even at 1:00 am, Ned... !
We're open to any mix-and-match arrangement which permits a comfortable retirement. Flexibility, including the capacity to get a bargain or few, has to be the answer.
As I've inferred, it's quite difficult to be sure of anything these days.
The immediacy of the internet means we all get continually conflicting and confusing data. When that data is exactly opposite, you have to ask WTF is going on!~
Comment by Stillgotshoeson on 2 December 2010:
Comment by Biker on 2 December 2010:
Despite this, very few WA families would have picked up 9.4% after tax, on their investments October 2009 - October 2010.
My Christian Fletchers have gone up over 55% already
Sell em today even after CGT and I am better than 25% after tax better off..
Thats in 2 weeks.. How about we annualise that.. 25x26=650% Figures and stats are amazing we can get what we want out of them.. even ABS stats that say 9.4%... wonder if they are annualised?
No need to be greedy though 300% Gross Profit will do
Comment by Stillgotshoeson on 2 December 2010:
Bought through Super Ned I think it could be as low as 4 homes.
1 live in and 3 Investment
3 Houses in Melbourne giving $400pw Tax Free (over 60 current tax free rules) is $1200pw, I could live on that.
Make it 4 investment for the few times 1 might be empty and you are still looking at $1600 on fully tenanted properties.
This is why houses appeal to me for "income" not wealth generation.
Nice steady income stream is appealing in my later years.. Making a non leveraged cash kitty is my aim for now. CGT on profits on shares through my super fund are only 15% for less than 12 months or 10% for more.
Comment by Chris in IT on 2 December 2010:
"If not, the banks may raise rates in December, despite RBA recommendations. Good luck, Euan!~"
I've got serious suspicions that the BOJ, FED and soon ECB printing presses will force the AUD so high as to make us suffer the same problems as China. Trouble is, with our bubble the way it is, we can't really afford to drop rates to make buying AUD priced exports attractive. RBA is range bound. Drop rates and private debt increases more, driving up assets again further decreasing stability of society. Increase rates, and the AJ carry looks better driving up AUD and killing business by making exports die. Lose-Lose. My prediction, unless china slows and the aud starts dumping we're in for a long series of minor adjustments not far off where we are today +\- 1-2% tops.
"The immediacy of the internet means we all get continually conflicting and confusing data. When that data is exactly opposite, you have to ask WTF is going on!~"
My view is that WA is making a killing off Chinese exports? With wages high, and local company profits strong due to a high AUD, people would 'feel' rich. Just look outside Australia and see the things that are burning down and you wonder how hard that snap back to reality is when China lowers imports due to building commodity inventory and tightening internal credit. Increasing chinese bank reserves is big money off the table.
As a pessimist I'm picking up on strong signals across the globe for media transmissions information being adjenda based, rather than impartial reports as it once was. Example, CNBC reports on continued recovery and annualised GDP growth of 5% based on one retail stat, from one month. ???. Food stamps are up, Housing inventory up, retail inventory up, unemployment up, national deficits up. The us gov is doing everything it can to restore growth, including lying about a recovery to get people spend to cause the recovery. I've be highly doubtful of a lot of data these days. Work out whats the angle and benefit of that data to the publisher before using it in making decisions.
Think of it this way. If the data came from Real Estate consortiums, then they would have an angle to want to move more sales right? Does 'dropping prices' say to your casual home owner 'sell, sell, sell' and lose your 10% deposit forever? Profit prospects have to be good to get them in to the RE offices. Most Joes will ride out minor dips and will only sell in to a loss if the banks make them because there is no such thing as a margin call on RE. There are always fresh faces to buy the hype. Only focusing on the positive markers is in their benefit is MO these days.
If I'm buying gold and release headlines about a gold bubble, or sovergn vault openeing all I'm doing is helping to secure better buy in prices right? Wasn't this illegal a while back?
Anyway, ask yourself this, why are you posting on a contraian website if you were RE optimistic in the first place? You're not convining anyone here! LOL... We're here because we fade Joe and Jane, not because we're them...
Comment by Biker on 2 December 2010:
Yes, you're definitely the average punter, Shoes.
I imagine hundreds of thousands of West Aussies score 300% every month...
Comment by Stillgotshoeson on 2 December 2010:
Comment by Biker on 2 December 2010:
Yes, you're definitely the average punter, Shoes.
I imagine hundreds of thousands of West Aussies score 300% every month.
After their drill results released today I might have to revise the figure to 1000% by this time next year...
Comment by Biker on 2 December 2010:
That's right, you never lose, son. You're a legend!~
Comment by Stillgotshoeson on 2 December 2010:
http://www.theage.com.au/business/retail-sales-in-surprise-dive-20101202-18h9g.html#poll
Retail Spend unexpected drop... People are obviously hurting
Comment by Stillgotshoeson on 2 December 2010:
Comment by Biker on 2 December 2010:
That's right, you never lose, son. You're a legend!~
Occasionally I take a hit... sometimes on purpose to make a win, sometimes just plain, dare I admit, wrong.. Always seem to win more than I lose.. Stop Losses prevent big losses. Sometimes I sell too early and do not make as much as I otherwise might have, but you never lose selling for a profit.
Share trading tip
Set Stop Losses and don't be greedy... never ever say I should have held longer because that could easily turn around and become I should have sold sooner.
Do not be a buy and hold "investor" If you want consistent dividends from your money... buy a house and get the rental..
Comment by Biker on 2 December 2010:
Yes, that should set the interest rate soaring, Shoes. Those four rentals will soon be yours... . I figure 8% is the tipping point. Not long to wait.
(Was that you acknowledging the 'God like powers' of your tipster, BTW?!)
Comment by Stillgotshoeson on 2 December 2010:
Is it just me? Or do you all see that Biker gets all narcy and defensive when I post about my good wins on Share Trades.. the ones that clearly outperform any of his property..
No, "Well done shoes nice to see your doing well", He seems to turn into Mr Negativity and the bitter sarcasm comes out because my share trades are proving consistent out performers of property.. I don't bag property, I think it has a place in a portfolio, just not mine, yet....
Comment by Stillgotshoeson on 2 December 2010:
Just bought 100000 Shares in another Gold Miner, I expect 100% by April next year.
Comment by Biker on 2 December 2010:
Is it just me, or has anyone noticed that Shoes obsessively posts negative comments about property here (and elsewhere)?
Any _tiny_ morsel gleaned from dozens of media sources is posted to demonstrate we're on the imminent edge of Keen's Krash... the Krash We Have to Have... . We even get to read The Dog Walker's opinion, FHS...
Shoes no longer posts weekly Auction Clearance Rates after I observed this obsession... but still can't resist these exciting little snippets ushering in impending doom.
Comment by gutfeeling on 2 December 2010:
"Shoppers shunned cafes and clothing outlets in October, sending retail sales to a surprise drop for the month and sparking worries about the pace of spending heading into Christmas.
Sales for the month fell 1.1 per cent, seasonally adjusted, to $20.2 billion, the biggest drop since July 2009. Economists had tipped a 0.4 per cent increase."
Retail sales in surprise dive
http://www.smh.com.au/business/retail-sales-in-surprise-dive-20101202-18h9g.html
Comment by Stillgotshoeson on 2 December 2010:
I am not negative on Property at all.. I am quite open in my belief that it should be part of a persons investment portfolio..
I just like to caution people that they should be careful with property investment, like all other investments because a)It DOES not always increase in value and b)It does not always double in value every 7 to 10 years like some (most) property bulls/spruikers would have them believe.
Auction Clearance a Rates are in the Low 60's High 50"s Percentile at the moment, tipped to fall even more..
I am watching more the average sales price rather than the actual clearance figure, that is telling me where the Auction action is most occuring.. Higher end, middle range properties.. Auctions generally in Melbourne are not popular in the sub 500k price range
Comment by Stillgotshoeson on 2 December 2010:
Drill results for my "Fletcher Cristians"
The results are listed in Table 1 for all intersections greater than 0.5g/t Au. They include:
· 2m @ 11.9g/t Au and 0.98% Cu
· 3m @ 19.9g/t Au and 2.0% Cu
· 16m @ 15.3g/t Au and 6.0% Cu
· 10m @ 5.4g/t Au and 1.9% Cu
· 4m @ 24.9g/t Au and 10.1% Cu
· 3m @ 12.5g/t Au and 3.1% Cu
· 2m @ 27.2g/t Au and 0.42% Cu in
· 10m @ 10.3g/t Au and 0.37% Cu
· 6m @ 16.0g/t Au and 2.2% Cu
Comment by Biker on 2 December 2010:
Hey, c'mon, Shoes... lighten up! Tell us what the meter reader thinks... .
Priceless, informed reading.
Really miss your weekly Auction Clearance Rates... and your 'tipped to fall' views.
Would you like me to provide my comments on "shares always double in value every 7 to 10 years" perhaps? I don't have much experience in the actual share market, but I'm sure that if I post that little message frequently enough you'll modify your investment practices.
Mate, you had a house once. You've made an offer on another. You're hardly a property expert, y'know?!
Must be getting boring for others here.
Have the last say, by all means.
Comment by Stillgotshoeson on 2 December 2010:
Comment by Biker on 2 December 2010:
Have the last LAUGH, by all means.
FIXED
Intend too
Comment by Biker on 2 December 2010:
to
Comment by Ned S on 2 December 2010:
Damn Biker - That's only the third one I've ever noticed - With you having 'fessed up to "to/too/two"? (or 'tu?'???) of them yourself anyway!
As I've said before, and will quite possibly say again, when/if the poo hits the proverbial, one's prospective mama in law is gunna want to know:
* Do you have a job?
* Do you own your digs?
* Do you have any money in the bank?
With car ownership also being pretty handy in a place like Oz.
Though I'm yet to personally strike a prospective mama in law who wants to know if I own any stocks and bonds or bullion?
Comment by Biker on 2 December 2010:
You'll recall my mom-in-law was adamant that her daughter wasn't going to marry a stockbroker... her father having practised this trade until his early nineties!~
But, as that old song notes: "Girls don't like boys, girls like cars and money ..." Just as well I owned a home and a motorcycle when I met TLOML...!~
On too/to/two, I offered the last word, not the last laugh.
On two occasions, I've found it too much to pass up. Et tu?
Comment by Biker on 2 December 2010:
Ned: "...mama in law who wants to know if I own any stocks and bonds or bullion?"
That term 'gold digger' comes to mine
here, Ned.
We have some fascinating stuff her other granddad dug up around Whitehorse.
Engineer on a paddlesteamer, he not only scored a lot of gold (which he fashioned into jewellery) but dug up a lot of mastodon ivory. Carved that into some beautiful heart-shaped pendants, etc.
Great old bloke, who left me, among other treasures, his fishing gear and an absolutely mint 1915 Lee-Enfield .303. After his regiment, The Engineers, built a bridge in France, he, alone, was left to guard it against the German army! My kinda bloke!!~
Comment by Ned S on 3 December 2010:
Sounds like his bloody regiment, didn't actually like, either fishermen, or stocks and bonds and bullion traders mate???
'Course if his mama in law liked him, that would've/could've helped - A lot!
Comment by Ned S on 5 December 2010:
An article that raises some issues concerning property through super on leverage:
http://www.smh.com.au/business/super-property-strategy-questionable-20101203-18jwc.html
Comment by Ned S on 6 December 2010:
My mum dropped in today. Could tell me that a friend of her's close by (20 km odd north of Brissie CBD) has just dropped the list price on her home by $30K - Husband is deceased and she doesn't want/need a large family home now. Next drop (if it doesn't sell now) will be less - Drop $10K off the ask is the plan. That would be getting close to a 10% drop on the initial ask overall. Things do seem to be correcting here. For now at least.
Comment by Steve on 6 December 2010:
But Ned I thought there was a major shortage of properties all over Australia?
This piece also tells me there is an oversupply in the market in Brisbane.
I thought the real estate industry was always right?
Comment by Biker on 6 December 2010:
We hear Gladstone is the complete opposite, Ned. Is that true?
Comment by rick e on 6 December 2010:
Hi biker a builder / accountant has built his last block of 9 units at hawthorn road brissy and is moving to Gladstone for the next 6 years and said he’ll be back .
But I don’t know what he’ll be doing there as he started out as a financial advisor and does not fancy that roll he is around 65y old.
Yes for sale houses are staying on the market longer and rents have dropt for the last 2 years as I have been following both in these post codes 4170 and 4171
Comment by Ned S on 6 December 2010:
Gladstone could well be worth a look. Speculative resources related stuff would be my general impression? (I got an email from a mate up that way working on the Alumina side of things asking if I knew of any jobs going early in the GFC as he'd been laid off.)
Townsville could even be interesting? Depending how much more paranoid we get, it will presumably continue growing as a major defense centre.
I'm personally sticking to Brissie though. As I've not got enough spare loot for any particularly speculative plays of any kind.
Comment by Biker on 6 December 2010:
Thanks, Rick.
Encouraged by the trend, family just bought a beachfront property on the Sunshine Coast.
Maybe I'll come over for another look at QLD...!~
Comment by Biker on 6 December 2010:
And Mr Happy's back!~
http://www.perthnow.com.au/business/how-to-burst-the-property-bubble/story-e6frg2ru-1225966340502
Comment by Ned S on 6 December 2010:
Dr Happy? He still doesn't seem to have figured out how things work in the real world. I think he'd get a better hearing from guv and policy makers if he was suggesting ways to slowly wind back real house prices and/or get a larger % of more affordable housing in the mix. But if he thinks they'll be intentionally doing anything to BURST any housing bubble, he's just not got a clue. Instability/sudden change is bad!!! I'm not bright. And I surely don't have an Ph.D in Ecobloodynomics! ... But even I've figured that one out.
I'm just at all sure what Keen's caper is sometimes?
Comment by Biker on 6 December 2010:
You have to wonder what is actually _happening_ inside that head. Imaginative concepts ricocheting about, pinging around in that cranium. Look inside. What do you see?
Happiness, pure 'n' simple. Here's a bloke who predicted a raft of dire scenarios for Australia... interest rates of zero, unemployment at ten percent, a 40% property crash. Sells his house to see its value s-o-a-r.
Loses Australia's most public property bet... .
"OK I fooled up. Let's see what other madcap stunt I can pull." Lightbulb flashes.... ZZZaaaaappppppppp! "I know. Let's shackle rents to loans. Brilliant! The BANKS will definitely buy THAT one. The GOVERNMENT will go for it! The construction industry will promote me as Aussie of the Year." (Continues ramblin' on... eyes rollin' well back in the head... .)
Keen's caper, Ned? Any publicity is _good_ publicity.
Tip to SK: Look HAPPY when you launch these fidiot schemes, son. A big confident grin. This downcast look might be the poignant trademark dial of doom'n'gloom Australia, but it's hardly inspirational... .
Comment by rick e on 6 December 2010:
Hi biker I have only been in brissy for the last 2 years. I ask some contractors where do most people go who had bought here 5 to 10 years ago, that when they sell up where do they go and they said Sunshine Coast or Maroochydore to retire .
It is a bit like when people left Sydney 5 to 10 to 20 years from black town, Penrith ect and are now doing the same from brissy to Sunshine Coast. And the cycle goes round again.
Oil has gone up that should help world inflation I think this rain is becoming a black swan
Comment by Biker on 6 December 2010:
"I think this rain is becoming a black swan"
Ah, but drought is worse, Rick.
Often wondered why Taleb created that particular term. There's really not too much to beat the sight of twenty or more swans riding the surf off our coast. They must be paddling like mad to look so much at ease in formation on a wave... .
Comment by rick e on 6 December 2010:
Ah, but drought is worse, Rick
yes
Comment by Ned S on 6 December 2010:
The Sunshine Coast has been my least favourite bit of QLD property wise for a good while now. At least Cairns just could get tourism back one day? And the Gold Coast has a casino and some meter maids to perve on if that's one's thing.
But who could seriously want to pay a shite load of loot to go and live in Oz's largest and most overpriced old folk's home for the lower to middle class? Where there isn't much work. Which a Brissie retiree like me can do a day trip type drive to and back from any day of the week anyway?
Though that's just my opinion.
Comment by Ned S on 6 December 2010:
The Sunshine Coast has been my least favourite bit of QLD property wise for a good while now. At least Cairns just could get tourism back one day? And the Gold Coast has a casino and some meter maids to perve on if that's one's thing.
But who could seriously want to pay a big heap of loot to go and live in Oz's largest and most overpriced old folk's home for the lower to middle class? Where there isn't much work. Which a Brissie retiree like me can do a day trip type drive to and back from any day of the week anyway?
Though that's just my opinion.
Comment by Lachlan on 6 December 2010:
Mate of mine in NSW was telling me a week and a half back he was seeing the farmers scrambling to bring in fantastic wheat crops while gazing at the rain on horizon. They had got within moments of making it pay. That night it started to rain and seven inches of rain in a short time destroyed everything. And after ten years of soul destroying drought some had gambled on this by borrowing quiet a bit. This week he tells me three farmers in the region have taken their lives since then. Heavy stuff. A lot blokes out there just been sucking it in and getting on with for a long time but it just too much in some cases.
It is still raining/showering here and predicted to stay that way into the forseeable future.
Comment by Biker on 6 December 2010:
They were just looking for a nice beachfront home, Ned.
They appear to have found it.
They really don't think they paid too much. Sold their Perth home high, high double work-from-home incomes, took advantage of a ten percent discount.
No intention to make money, just wanted the tropical lifestyle... .
Comment by Ned S on 6 December 2010:
"No intention to make money, just wanted the tropical lifestyle" - Brissie is more than tropical enough for me mate. The more one goes further north, the more the joint gets effing HOT. (People in Cairns even build rooves over their pools to get the sun off!
)
Nope, hanging out on the Sunshine Coast with all the other geriatrics isn't my envisioned retirement. Though I just could choose to drive up there once every month or three?
Comment by Chris in IT on 7 December 2010:
Is this the Somersoft forums?
Comment by Stillgotshoeson on 7 December 2010:
Comment by Chris in IT on 7 December 2010:
Is this the Somersoft forums?
No.. however it is the right room for an argument
Comment by Lachlan on 7 December 2010:
No its not
Comment by Biker on 7 December 2010:
Any financial newsletter whose descriptors and search criteria _commence_ with "Australian House Prices Are Severely and Seriously Unaffordable" can expect to attract both property investors and property detractors, Chris.
Kinda like a red flag to a bull... !
An analogy I've discovered recently is that of the bottled water salesmen.
Decades ago, we all drank tap water. Most of the time, in the West, it was very safe to do so. Soft drink manufacturers suffered declining profits as families started to reject fizzy sugar drinks. Their need for expansion meant the necessity to undermine confidence in tap water... and sell water at immence profit, to a more affluent Western populace.
Likewise, the need to continually talk property down, to sell other products, is tempting. It's relatively easy, too. You: a.) keep citing property crashes elsewhere; b.) question the stability of lenders; c.) alert the public to every impending interest rate rise; d.) spruik repossessions; e.) report any falls in sales, auction clearances, etc, etc.
In many ways it's defensible. My product is better than your product.... .
Where it's highly questionable is when Melbourne-based money spruikers launch scores of fake posts, purporting to be another state's citizens, daily. Gotta take issue and publicise that little scam... .
Comment by Biker on 7 December 2010:
Uh, IMMENSE profit...!
Comment by Lachlan on 7 December 2010:
SAR last sale 77.5 cents Shoes (up 35%)
I think the current breakout will top closeer to a dollar.
Comment by Biker on 7 December 2010:
And, just in case you doubt my case, Chris, look at this:
http://www.perthnow.com.au/business/news/borrowers-to-be-spared-december-rate-rise-economists/comments-e6frg2qu-1225965264347
Here's a Melbourne shonk, posting as a WA citizen. Two thirds of the posts are his. 90%+ of the argument is his. The site blocks most opinions to the contrary. The adverts below most of the articles have links to his site.
I now have 39 screenshots to demonstrate this. I'll notify you when MY site goes up!
Comment by Stillgotshoeson on 7 December 2010:
#
Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype Posted at 1:29 PM December 04, 2010
Property spruikers will tell you there will be a small fall of 5-10% & then prices will PLATEAU or move sideways then BOOM when wages catch up?. Property investment is O*N*L*Y based on capital gains, without this or the prospect of a quick sharp turnaround with massive rises to offset the past 3 years stagnant performance TRUE investors will shortly cut their losses & bolt for the exits. Remember you have investors who bought in December 07 @ a Median of $475K looking at Dec 2010 Median being only $475K ZERO Capital Gains after 3 years & with average A*F*T*E*R__ T*A*X losses of $7500K PA . Forecasters say prices will stay flat for the next 2-3 years So all these investors can look forward to is 6 years of next to ZERO Growth & losses of $50K plus??? How long do you think they can afford to wait, before they cut their losses? BTW the TAX office says that 80% of people claiming deductions for residential property had incomes of L*E*S*S than $70K pa so these people are not made of money & cant afford to wait it out. These are the first to head for the exits causing prices to I*M*P*L*O*D*E ... It is wishful thinking if you think prices will only go down 5-10% ....
Comment 4 of 9
#
Not Fooled By Property Spruikers Hype Posted at 1:59 PM December 04, 2010
Oct 2008 the GFC Hit & the RBA reduced official rates to 3% by Jan 2009. Interest Rates went from 9.5% in in Aug 2008 to under 4.75% in Jan 2009 ... Banks were offering Fixed 2 year loans @ 5% - 5.5% many New home Buyers (Plus existing home owners) took advantage of this & locked in these rates. Now 2 years have lapsed & all these loans are going to revert to a 7.1% or 7.8% rate. An increase around 50% or around $750 PM on a typical home loan. Now bear in mind most of these FHB could not get a loan because they could not save enough for a deposit whilst renting at half the cost of ownership & the only way the got the deposit together was with a boost to the FHOG & $900 per child handouts x 2 {Remember that GIFT?}Now all these home owners that could not even save for a deposit prior to 2008 have been paying an additional $10K PA in costs for home ownership (Gap between Renting & Buying) & in 2011 they can ALL look forward to extra payments around $9000 PA. ($20K all up)They know they cant do it as the Credit Card is already maxed out paying this years Rates / Water / Ins etc they never could afford housing because they just did not earn enough & now the good times are over!
Comment 5 of 9
Above comments from Franks post above.
I think they are not too far from the situation that FHB's and "average" property investors (earning ,$80k pa) are in.
Comment by Chris in IT on 7 December 2010:
The part I don't get is that we're sitting on the cusp of a global debt meltdown, watching it in progress. The EU will likely default at some point, the germans will pull out, the irish revolt, etc.. At some point Contigation will come knocking, and as one of the most highly levered residential markets on the planet to me it's been screaming 'get out' for the last three years. Frankly, I'm seeing people just get priced out of a market due to leveraged bidding wars. My mate bought in Lilyfield for ~980k, from what I understand the only reason he even had a deposit is because he kept all his 50k credit cards! It's a small 3br townhouse, maybe 5m wide. Around the corner someone is selling his driveway to build a new house on... !!!
From where I sit I see the world unravelling. I'm not a permabear but see profits in very different places. My investment (unlevered) made be 7% last week alone. No stocks, or derivaties involved and it's physical, so can't be unmade. I only mention this to explain that I'm not growing my food in the mountains waiting for the world to end (though I can and do grow my own food \ save seed \ own a spare property well out of the city, etc).
What I don't understand the use of high debt in the middle of a major debt crisis. Even if we wave a wand and go back to 2000 for another 7 year ride, peak oil will wipe us clean in so many ways. I have been following these problems for a solid 5 years now, night after night.
The somersoft reference was tongue in cheek. Even if you guys are buying all these houses in cash, you're playing a game on a team with some very weak unskilled players. Most will fold easily as their finances are so delicate, which will kill the market as easily as it killed every market around the world...
Why ignore all of what's happening around us? I just don't get it...
Comment by Biker on 7 December 2010:
Why print only two of the shonk's posts, Shoes? There are four more just like it. Nine posts and two thirds are his.
I see your mate Euan also posts from time-to-time, too. Lots of Irishmen in Kwinana!~
Comment by Biker on 7 December 2010:
Chris: "(I) own a spare property well out of the city, etc"
I'd get out as fast as you can, son. Rates will rise (TODAY!) We're just like IRELAND! Unemployment will rise to TEN PERCENT. China is a BUBBLE! CREDIT CARD DEBT is upon us, etc, etc...
(Sell bottled water on the weekends, Chris? Is that what IT stands for...?
)
You spelling your name correctly, son?
Comment by Chris in IT on 7 December 2010:
The RBA won't be able to control it. All you need is a hiccup in China to to drop the AUD. We're China's proxy now after all. We get the bad with all this good. If the AUD drops, banking funding costs will increase. The RBA may well drop rates to 'help' but to me they are besieged now. Drop rates and pump more gas in to the balloon, increase rates and drop it. I can't imagine they can act out more than 2% i either direction now without causing a problem. Plus, as EU and US banking falls apart, global bond rates will go up anyway on contigation risks, even if we maintain excellent ratings. All that goes to do is screw the weakest link... the overlevered home owners...
Looks like a tinderbox to me. So much so that I sold out of all my city properties 2 years ago. I'm not going to be in the theatre when the fire starts.
The spukers don't really bother me. They are always there... like annoying commercials on TV, or Persian rug salemen selling 90% off... They are merely angling.
But here of all places. The site of the contrarians, constantly talking about returns and rent on property, where is up, where is flat... doesn't really matter does it. Pretty much every aussie city is top 20 most expensive places to live in the world. Is that because our healtcare is too high? What about our food? Or, perhaps people spending 40-60% of their income on a house might be part of it? Double incomes are now pretty much necessary, there is not much left to stretch and, well, look in the distance... I see a storm coming and nobody is preparing... Boggles my mind...
Comment by Chris in IT on 7 December 2010:
OK
In any case I'll leave you all to it. The clear avoidance of my questions are noted, with no hard feelings. I wish you the best in real estate, and a continuation of the world as it is 
Comment by rick e on 7 December 2010:
Chris in IT Charles Nenner Look him up he is out there but I like him.
Charles Nenner says to split the euro up in 2. a strong and weak euro (meaning the strong countries stay together and the week get group) he says if France goes belly up then we are all in trouble. He was interviewed on yahoo teck ticker I cannot find it.
This is him on another subject http://finance.yahoo.com/tech-ticker/deflationary-hurricane-will-slam-into-u.s.-economy-charles-nenner-says-535664.html?tickers=%5EDJI,%5EGSPC,TLT,TBT,%5EGLD,UUP,EWJ
Comment by Chris in IT on 7 December 2010:
I guess if the NFP data is anything to go by they are already sliding backwards. Less currency circulation would lead to deflation, but due to external cost increases (fuel, imports, etc), they would probably see inflation in anything that has a foreign component and deflation of local assets. In particular in China nudges their currency rates higher... I expect higher US unemployment.
I'm really not sure how a split euro could contain the counterparty risks? Would not the 'strong' participants have to take a loss to allow the weaker nations to not default, it would be a markdown right? Isn't this like a partial loss? I thought haircuts were off the table?
I think Ireland should just default and get it over with. The people o Iceland are doing fine. Reminds me of when I was a kid and had to take some awful medicine and just held it in my mouth, not swallowing, either you spit it out or swallow... can't hold it there forever...
Comment by Biker on 7 December 2010:
Bottled water would fix that, Chris.
Comment by Chris in IT on 7 December 2010:
Bah! I fed the seagulls. Now your just going to stand there squawking waiting for another chip huh?
hahaha
I should have read between the lines. The Real Estate salesmen here are just protecting their turf. Gotcha! "You gold and silver bugs are not welcome here son." would have saved me a few keystrokes. No biggie... I'm in a pretty good mood these days anyway, if only because you probably take me to be 20 years younger than I am.
For anyone else interested in gold \ silver, head over here:
http://tfmetalsreport.blogspot.com/2010/12/new-record-closes-in-gold-silver.html
Decent running commentary on 'non real estate' investments in case DR doesn't feed you enough...
Comment by Lachlan on 7 December 2010:
Yeah common DR, silver is blitzing and you can teach people about it. In Oz the prices are about 40% higher over last 12months and the AUD has been strong!!!! What happens when we have a pullback? We know its good money in a tough financial time but crumbs its going the way of the dodo also...yeah extinct. Heres some quality silver info just to get started.
"World silver inventories are at the lowest point in 200 years. Industry requires over 900 million ounces each year. Silver is the best conductor of electricity. Every computer, server, monitor, cell phone and switch must have silver. Lasers, satellites, high-tech weaponry and robotics, all require silver. Digital technology and telecommunications need silver. Around the house there's silver in every TV, washing machine, wall switch and refrigerator. Conductors, switches, contracts and fuses use silver because it does not corrode or cause overheating and fires. Silver is used heavily in photography and in prints. Meanwhile, new and exotic uses for silver are expanding.
A new double layer of silver on glass is sweeping the window market, as it reflects away almost 95% of the hot rays of the sun. A new electronic application for "smart tags" that are replacing bar codes could use significant quantities of silver.
Silver achieves the most brilliant polish of any metal and is the best reflector of light, allowing it to be used in mirrors and in coatings for glass, cellophane or metals. Chemical reactions can be significantly increased by adding silver. Approximately 700 tons of silver are in continuous use in the world's chemical industry for the production of plastics.
Batteries are now manufactured with silver alloys. Lead-free silver solder is used heavily for joining materials and producing leak-tight joints. Silver is also widely used in silk-screened circuit paths, membrane switches, electrically heated automobile windows, and adhesives. Silver has a variety of uses in pharmaceuticals. Silver sulfadiazine is the most powerful compound for burn treatment. Catheters impregnated with silver eliminate bacteria. Silver is increasingly being tapped for its bactericidal properties and water purification. In the face of all these industrial uses there is less silver available.
Here we have a vital material, known to all men for all time, literally disappearing before our eyes, both above and below ground. It is a material upon which modern life and rising standards of living are dependent. It is beyond indispensable, it is a miracle metal."
Excerpt...from a Bill Downey piece.
Crumbs BP, they're even building houses out of it. Well windows anyhow.
Comment by Lachlan on 7 December 2010:
SAR in full flight Shoes... 81.5cents
Comment by Biker on 7 December 2010:
Chris: "The Real Estate salesmen here are just protecting their turf."
Prefer to go around them if we can. We generally buy and sell without paying their silly commi$$ions. Don't start me on FAs!
To each his own. A previous post infers you have two properties (if indeed you 'have a spare'.) It's always a good idea to walk-the-talk, practise-what-you-preach sort of thing. Keen showed us how. Chuc-c-c-k-k-k those costly unproductive properties! Give 'em the old heave-ho. Do it as publicly as you can. TV cameras, radio, websites, the lot. Worked for Steve, so I guess it would work for you, too.
Anti-PM? Anti-shares? Where did you get that idea? My 'PERTHNO Melbourne' site won't be anti bullion or anti shares. It doesn't need to create fear or uncertainty, as I really don't care if these rise or fall. It will simply illuminate an imported fear campaign... .
Comment by Chris in IT on 7 December 2010:
"if indeed you 'have a spare'"
I've populated it with a non paying relative. It's out of the way, and I'm using permiculture techniques to improve the sites water retention, upgrading soil, etc. I rent in the inner city. The cost of the out lying property is low compared to the benefits in a SHTF scenario. I know what to do with it if it ever comes to that. Its not an investment, more of an insurance policy.
More later... have to head out.
Comment by Biker on 7 December 2010:
"Crumbs BP, they're even building houses out of it. Well windows anyhow."
Sounds, good, Lachlan. Let's hope it happens.
A couple of years back, we looked into this:
http://www.smartcompany.com.au/construction-and-engineering/dyesol-s-electric-blue-sky.html
Theoretically, it sounded pretty awesome... used the same principles as photosynthesis to create electricity from building materials: glass, metal, etc. I figure that emulating nature is probably a desirable future path.
The company, which had approached several Aussie governments, finally went offshore (eastern Europe?) Labour costs were cited as a reason.
I recall the shares hitting $1.50+. I think they're currently around 70c.
Promising concept, which is yet to reach fruition... .
Comment by Lachlan on 7 December 2010:
Well I agree actually BP. And I considered buying DYE a couple years back. Strange how what seems to be a groundbreaking idea can struggle to get into the market place? At least the defense fellas saw a good thing.
Comment by Stillgotshoeson on 7 December 2010:
Chris... If I had a house I had paid cash for, I would not care if it dropped 40% 50% 90%.. The purpose of the house would not be investment, but shelter... My children would care, as the benefactors of my will.. but I would not care a drot.
Investment properties would concern me a little more.. however, Incomw for me through an investment property is of more concern.. as long as they remain occupied and paid me decent regular income I would be happy. As again,, the kids would be more concerned with property "value".
Biker.. of his comments.. I like those two the best and agree pretty much with there content.
Comment by Biker on 7 December 2010:
I think it's most magnanimous of Charley Nenner to host a non-paying relative, therewith declining negative gearing on this property.
Money and taxation benefits are clearly no object!
As you're a highly successful share speculator, Shoes, I'm pleased to learn that you see housing as shelter. I was totally misled by your recount of your recent attempted purchase.
Amazed you agree with John N Fool's comments. Simply gobsmacked.
His better stuff forecasts interest rates going through the roof.
Always good for a chuckle... .
Comment by Ned S on 7 December 2010:
The blokes at DRA do say some humourous things:
"I risked my life verifying the fact that this stock could make you 389% in two years. The least you can do is watch this free video and find out why" – Dr. Alex Cowie
A tip for risk averse African tourists Doc: Ansell was a still a highly recommended provider of insurance last time I looked?
Comment by Ned S on 7 December 2010:
I'm just hoping Doc Alex didn't have to 'bend over backwards' (or forwards even for that matter?) to bring us all this info??? - But if he did, then can only hope, he invested in all and any necessary extra high risk coverage products perhaps? What a bloody hoot! Smart people do say some extraordinarily stupid things on occasion ...
Comment by Biker on 7 December 2010:
"Smart people do say some extraordinarily stupid things on occasion ...
"
Seems almost plausible compared to Kris Skayce's affirmation of 'God-like powers' in stock selection. Disclaimers one-after-the-other, but the fact remains that Kris' omnipotence transcends us mere mortals. 'God-like powers' for Kris'Sake.
How prozakked might one have to be to imagine this as a sensible lead-in... if you follow my drift?!~
Comment by Ned S on 7 December 2010:
We are BOTH going to get banned soon I suspect if you continue saying things like that Biker? Best you tone it down - I'm a property bearling - So won't be missed - In amongst the toothier types. But a genuine bull (albeit a bit more mellow on the bellow going forward for a while maybe?) really shouldn't be lost to any site. IMO.
Comment by Biker on 7 December 2010:
Mate, I've been wiping cookies and trojans out of my system for days!~
I actually respect DRA in _this_ format. I guess you have to ask, have I spoken the truth? Have you seen the actual presentation in which Kris provides 'Stan's testimony? Fantastic imagery: words keep appearing
like those on a PowerPoint. The sophistication is unimaginable!
It's almost biblical... then Stan's words magically appear: 'God-like Power'
I was overcome the first time I saw it... fell to me knees... blinded by
the realisation that Kris has come again... to save us from Armagedding.
Ban me? Past efforts have failed on PerthNow. I love a challenge.
Comment by Ned S on 8 December 2010:
"... blinded by the realisation that Kris has come again...."
Being a deeply spiritual person, that brought the first line of "The Battle Hymn of the Republic" to mind for some reason mate?
Comment by Biker on 8 December 2010:
I too was swept up in an epiphany of spiritual song, mate.
Hummed the entire verse of 'Rule Britannia, marmalade and jam...'